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Really Struggling with Knee Pain

It's now been a couple of weeks since I posted that last update and I have been through the ringer but I'm glad to say I am in a much better place now. :)

After that post I tried to resume running again, but it was painful during the run and BOY was it ever painful after, especially the next morning. I was dogged and determined though and continued to just push through it, try to ignore it, downplay it, etc...whatever I could do to force my brain to accept it as TMS. I even developed a mantra "it's not dangerous, it's completely harmless" anytime it would flare up.

Honestly, that didn't work too well. I would still get random pain, and the pattern it did follow was very much in line with what I was throwing at it running wise and getting steps in, etc. I got back onto a round of NSAIDs and it blunted the pain again.

Earlier this week I was in a particularly bad spot, and had resorted to doing all sorts of physical treatments - rolling the calves, stretching the calves, rolling my foot over massage balls - all the usual PT stuff one does for Plantar Fascitis. After a couple of days of that (admittedly with some relief), I realized the absurdity of it and instead went in the TMS direction. Did some somatic tracking, some meditation, read some Ozanich and Sarno books, and probably most importantly I made a page long list of current worries and fears.

That was night before last and I woke the next morning with a near 90% reduction in symptoms. Almost like a miracle.

I went for a run that day and while the foot did not hurt at all prior to that run, it immediately was painful on every step but I ignored it and finished out the 35min run despite the pain. Afterwards though, and significantly, I wasn't hobbled or experiencing any uptick in pain. Same thing for this morning, and THIS time I went for a run and did not immediately experience any shoots of pain on every step, instead just some mild tightness and soreness as the run went on.

This is significant and I think I am on my way to kicking this thing to the curb. Sometimes this stuff seems like magic, it's almost too good to be true (or maybe that's just what my doubting, worrying mind wants me to think!).

Happy to share a positive update here.
 
Despite the "positive update" above, apparently unbeknownst to me at the time, my battle was not yet over. I had severe "flares" that I had to work through over the last few weeks. Despite being "sure" (I put in question marks because there is always some part of us that doubts this process) it was TMS I just could not eradicate it.

I tried all my usual methods:

Journaling
Listening to podcasts
re-reading Sarno/Ozanich/Alan-Gordon

I'll spare the details of all the ups/downs, the waves of exhaustion, etc. It wasn't until I had a breakthrough this week that things got better. Reading some success stories here at the TMS wiki specifically for Plantar Fasciitis triggered something within me (I also had a deep insight into something that was troubling me since childhood) - and I had a complete cessation of symptoms for an afternoon and evening. I made SURE to note that on my "evidence sheet" - and in a few days the symptoms have lessened and lessened. I believe part of the problem is I was doing the "work" but only from the standpoint of getting rid of the pain. It's hard to do but you have to remove that goal from your mind and just do the work for its own benefit. Again this is easy to say but hard to do (at least for me).

I think the lesson here, for me, is to try our best to work through the doubt and also achieve "outcome independence"
 
Mr Hip Guy said:
I believe part of the problem is I was doing the "work" but only from the standpoint of getting rid of the pain. It's hard to do but you have to remove that goal from your mind and just do the work for its own benefit. Again this is easy to say but hard to do (at least for me).

I think the lesson here, for me, is to try our best to work through the doubt and also achieve "outcome independence"
Click to expand...

Yes! This is one of the most important keys to recovery.
 
Update - I don't have time for a long post but wanted to update the thread since it's been over a month.

I'm still dealing with some Plantar Fasciitis pain, but it's reduced and manageable. It's just being stubborn for some reason, but *I'm* stubborn so it makes sense.

But as this PF pain has been on the wane, guess what has been on the upswing? Yep, the knee pain.

It is VERY hard for me to ignore physical/structural possibilities as they pop up in my head. I have simply not been able to eradicate the "go to" of thinking immediately "well I have been cycling alot lately" or "this always flares up when I start doing xx activity."

If I didn't have a massive, book-like evidence sheet for why I am TMS prone it would be terribly discouraging. As it stands, I just know I have work to do and this will likely be a lifelong struggle in some way at least.
 
Ludmilla said:
Hi @Mr Hip Guy, how are you doing ? Did your knees get better ?
Click to expand...

Thank you for asking!

BOTH my knee pain and my plantar fasciitis are much better. The PF is completely eradicated...a couple of months ago it just vanished after plaguing me severely for 5+ months. That's a story in itself.

The knee is still occasionally "twingy" but given what I am throwing at it each day (lots and lots of cycling and running and exercise), it is doing great. I'm thoroughly convinced it is TMS and nothing else.
 
My knee pain is pretty minimal, definitely manageable and it doesn't stop me from doing anything I want to do, but it's not completely eradicated. I have managed to separate myself from worrying about it anymore though, a type of outcome-independence I guess.

My plantar fascitis however, is completely eradicated and has been for at least 4 months now.

Anyway, I come to you today with a new symptom! :)

Chest pain!

About two months ago, I was on vacation with my family and had a bout with TMS. Something about that trip was stressful (as we know vacations often are, and not for obvious reasons) and I had a round of "neck crick" and a particularly bad rash of hiccups. I had never considered the possibility of hiccups as TMS but once I made this connection and realization, they too vanished. Hiccups as TMS, who knew?

Anyway, that weekend I also had some odd chest pain, that I had put in the same camp as the "neck crick" and didn't worry too much about it. When it was still around though, 2 weeks later, I started to get concerned. You see, 5 years ago I had a pulmonary embolism (i.e. "blood clot"), in both lungs, and had to be admitted to the hospital for treatment. I will never forget the look on the ER nurse's face when she heard it was a PE "in both lungs" (because I later found out it has a 80+ % mortality rate). Anyway, needless to say, chest pain now gets my attention.

So a doctor visit, and subsequent EKG and d-dimer test later, PE and heart attack was ruled out. I went about my business assuming this was TMS and it would go away. A month+ later, and it's sticking around. :(

I think it is aggravated by the fact I have been doing some strength work that stresses that area of my chest, but it's odd that I feel it on deep breaths (like a PE). Sometimes the pain moves to the back beneath my shoulder blade, but usually it is right over my heart on the front. In searching this forum I see others with similar symptoms and came across a condition that is new to me, a veteran of many ailments:

Costochondritis

Google says that is an "inflammation" of cartilage in the rib case.

Honestly, I don't know if having this new information will hurt or help me, I am often swayed by "conditions" but maybe in this case visualizing my body creating inflammation (as TMS often does) will cause it to dispel. In the meantime, it is back to evidence lists, listening to podcasts, and journaling to see if I can get this one to also go away like the others.
 
My knee has been bugging me again recently, coinciding with some increase in cycling I've been doing. This correlation/causation is hard for me to ignore so I'm reviewing this thread to get things back to baseline again.

Note that in my last post 6mo ago that chest pain I wrote about...surprise...resolved itself a few months later. TMS strikes again.
 
Well, HG - my current theory is that in these trying times, it's always gonna be f'ing something. And that the best we can do is try to retain some kind of equanimity (which will invariably fluctuate) in the face of massive uncertainty and utter lack of control. Two things which humans HATE and which cause our survival-based brains an inordinate amount of existential stress.

It sounds trite, but even little things help, and I do my very best to find just one thing each day to either appreciate about myself, or for which I am grateful. Preferably both, and sometimes they are the same thing. Writing it down helps. Then sometimes you might find yourself writing down some of the shit as well - in which case, go for it!
 
Thank you, those are wise words.

It's funny how we overcomplicate this, with our catastrophizing and worry and doubt...the solution is pretty basic instead. Most of us with TMS are pretty hard on ourselves so it's not "being soft" if we do exactly as you say, show some appreciate and self-compassion...of all people we need it!
 
Recently I lost a beloved family pet, and suddenly at that. He apparently had a brain tumor/lesion and basically overnight the tumor grew enough to manifest in severe neurlogical symptoms. The poor ol' fella lost sight in one eye, and could not stand/walk on his own. On one hand I felt blessed that he didn't have to suffer long (from first symptoms to his death was a short 36 hours), on the other hand, nothing that happened felt like a blessing.

This was a couple of weeks ago, and since then my TMS has responded with a laundry list of symptoms. Sore lower back after a long bike ride (I almost never have back pain so I openly laughed at that one), headaches/earaches, excessively itchy patches of skin in random spots, overly sore muscles from normal activities...

...and the old bugaboo of knee pain.

I'm still in mourning for my good boy, but will have to find some time/energy to do the work again to get this resolved.
 
Update - My knee pain or lack thereof is about as good as it has ever pain, despite throwing so much at it (currently cycling 8-9+ hours a week plus running another 3). I would've never believed this was "fixable"* prior to this, but I'm living proof.

* - Distinctly remember my PT that was working with me post-hip-surgery openly laughing when I told him about my "runners knee" and whether there was a fix. Talk about disconcerting!
 
@Mr Hip Guy thanks so much for sharing your journey in this thread, it’s motivating knowing others are having similar experiences. I’ve been experiencing patellofemoral knee sensations for the past couple months which came on as I was getting more engaged with cycling and overcoming TMS in my arms. Excited to focus on my knee from a similar perspective now!

How have your symptoms been lately?
 
Hi! Sorry to hear you're getting hit with some pain in your knee. My update is basically a repeat of my previous entry in June. All systems go and I am doing aLOT with my knees - more focused on running now than cycling but still doing a ton of both.

I would suggest applying whatever worked on your arms to your knees. sounds like the ol' "symptom imperative" at work here. Good luck!
 
Update - I continue to plug along. doing what I want to do (running, cycling, hiking, weightlifting etc) with minimal to minor issue with my knee.

One odd thing I have noticed however, and this has been going on for awhile, is this symptom I get where my knee actually "itches" - meaning the surface of my skin directly above where the pain comes from actually itches. Back when I thought my knee problem was structural, this made no sense whatsoever - I mean if I have a torn meniscus (or whatever), then why would it make the skin itch? But now that I know this is TMS, I'm wondering what the mechanism is for causing this sensation. Is it just trying to call attention to the area, any way it can?
 
Mr Hip Guy said:
Update - I continue to plug along. doing what I want to do (running, cycling, hiking, weightlifting etc) with minimal to minor issue with my knee.

Is it just trying to call attention to the area, any way it can?
Click to expand...

Could be...pay attention to when it starts. See if anything is attached to it or not.
I have had mystery elbow skin pain for a few years.
Someone once (believe it or not) criticized my elbows (some folks have 0 filter and will say the weirdest things) and I am sure it's tied to this weird sensation.
 
Not a great weekend has some symptoms flaring back up. Had some unfortunate things happen with vehicles - accidents and damage, almost all of which was my fault. Made me think of my dad who passed 5 years ago this month and was always a 'car guy' and instilled in me the importance of keeping a car in good shape and well maintained etc.

...but yet all that has been going through my head since is his voice saying "can't take care of the the nice things you have." Literal dreams I had last night with him in them. Again right at 5 years since he passed away. Then beating myself up with thoughts of "what are you complaining about - look at how good you got it" etc.

And of course, multiple symptoms flaring back up. I need to get back to work on that while also processing my anger, shame, sadness, etc.
 
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