4.5 Years of Chronic Pain Resolved in 2 Months

[BloodMoon]

@CalmIsTheCure I really hear what you’re saying about there being no safe or pain‑free place to build up from. That makes a lot of the usual graded exposure explanations feel like they don’t fit your reality at all.

In my own case, I haven’t had a truly neutral, pain‑free base either. However, I still found that taking baby steps – doing a little, resting, and slowly increasing (and not being despondent or giving up when my brain rebelled and I had to take two steps back before being able to gradually move forward again) – has gradually changed how my brain responds with regard to giving me symptoms. The overall trajectory has always been forward with improvement, even if for a lot of the time it certainly didn’t feel that way to me.

I’m kind of living proof that taking tiny steps – combining various techniques and thinking in different ways to how I used to think – in a constant‑pain situation can actually work. But if it’s not for you, then it’s not for you. There’s plenty of free material out there, such as on Dr Fanestil’s and Raelan Agle’s YouTube channels, that comes at things from different angles. I’m no Pollyanna, but something is likely to hit the spot for you. I wish you well.

 

[Mani]

And I have been getting better slightly but it doesnt feel like that is my own doing. Obviously I know its moving because of things I implemented but if it stopped getting better i wouldnt really know what to do.

And i still dont know what im supposed to do if im fully better and suddenly i get into an accident and an airbag deploys (170db) and this all starts over again when i already have a family. Yeah then what? Only reason ive been getting better is because no one is relying on me right now.

I need to somehow accept that i just live my life knowing that the guillotine blade can fall on my neck at any time. Yeah sure sure ill try to get through it another time but i wouldnt like to bet on myself. Sounds is everywhere mate. What if all sounds fucking hurt?

 

[Mani]

And its like 'yeah Mani, we know, complaining wont get you anywhere.'

You bet i know that but it still feels like my life from now on will just be like a mountain goat walking up a dam. Just right on the edge and the smallest of things happening and its game over. I dont know how to cope with it. I can only try to repress it which has brought me no good at all in my life ever

 

[Mani]

I myself have paid several coaches and none of them have actually helped me work out the problem. They have just said try staring out the window, count how many red things you can see, hum, meditate.

LOL

'I would like some ideas on how to cope with devastating panic attacks after ptsd therapy where i feel like im gonna die and nothing can soothe me.

Therapist: 'Just put your thoughts in a jar mate'

Right, incredibly helpful

And i see panic attacks as another form of tms now. Usually your body trying to tell u something your mind is rejecting. Thats why im quite thankful that i found the tms space. Its just something that really does align with how i think it works

 

[Adam Coloretti (coach)]

Personally the threat of a setback makes 'safety' impossible to me. I can only somewhat fake it and do small baby steps but the pain isnt going just by itself. I'm afraid of getting worse. I can try not to think about it but i feel the threat of it all. My situation is paradoxical in nature and theres no solution to it. I need to accept setbacks but if only setbacks came from exposure, then what?

So what's happened is (and this happens with everyone when it comes to TMS), the fuel that makes it chronic and gives it its power is the initial belief we have that there is something wrong with us structurally. If we knew it was TMS from the beginning, it likely wouldn't have persisted.

Now that you know and (hopefully) believe it is TMS, it can never be as bad as it was from a recovery perspective. The symptoms can ramp up based on conditioned responses and you exposing yourself, but that's normal and the conditioned response itself was largely fuelled by this belief in the structural (because if an activity causes symptoms and you think the symptoms reflect damage, then of course you're going to be petrified of the action). The conditioned response still has power from then (and it persists in large part through avoidance), but the more your belief in TMS grows (it's always growing) and the more exposures you have without the freak out (that were at their worst when you thought it was structural), the weaker they will get.

That's why (and I did this with a client too yesterday) when Alan Gordon challenges someone to move their neck when they haven't in years and it doesn't cause pain, he's primed them by convincing them in a sense that there is nothing wrong with their neck. Once they believe that, sometimes it kills the conditioned response there and then (especially if they genuinely haven't done the action in years, so they may not have ever felt pain doing it ironically or it was years ago). They are naturally amazed, but it makes complete sense based on TMS theory.

I'll continue by responding to your other posts as they are on another page.

 

[Adam Coloretti (coach)]

And I have been getting better slightly but it doesnt feel like that is my own doing. Obviously I know its moving because of things I implemented but if it stopped getting better i wouldnt really know what to do.

And i still dont know what im supposed to do if im fully better and suddenly i get into an accident and an airbag deploys (170db) and this all starts over again when i already have a family. Yeah then what? Only reason ive been getting better is because no one is relying on me right now.

I need to somehow accept that i just live my life knowing that the guillotine blade can fall on my neck at any time. Yeah sure sure ill try to get through it another time but i wouldnt like to bet on myself. Sounds is everywhere mate. What if all sounds fucking hurt?

It doesn't feel like your own doing because the idea that there's nothing actually wrong with you is seeping in and calming your brain - the more time you spend in the TMS lens the better (you also contradicted yourself in that in the last post you said the pain isn't going by itself, and then now you said you're getting better (albeit slightly).

If the airbag caused those symptoms (at that level of intensity), then you wouldn't be fully better - because you're recovering more so from the fear than the symptoms themselves (that's what fuels the symptoms, especially the really high levels). You need to fully appreciate that the freak outs which led to the conditioned responses were fuelled in large part (like I said in the previous message) by your belief in the structural. You're in essence fearing something with which the fuel for it doesn't exist anymore. It would be like fearing getting shot when you know there's no bullets in the gun.

Once you're better, even if the airbags caused some symptoms (the symptoms would massively reduce through recovery), you wouldn't care because you'd know it's just TMS. That indifference (like fear does) feeds on itself until eventually you wouldn't even think about potential triggers.

I'm not judging you based on complaining and I'm not saying that the symptoms wouldn't suck or telling you get over it - I'm saying you're operating on a false premise. This is actually a good example of a "spot" we were talking about before and an example of needing to align your thoughts and actions with the TMS belief

 

[CalmIsTheCure]

@CalmIsTheCure I really hear what you’re saying about there being no safe or pain‑free place to build up from. That makes a lot of the usual graded exposure explanations feel like they don’t fit your reality at all.

In my own case, I haven’t had a truly neutral, pain‑free base either. However, I still found that taking baby steps – doing a little, resting, and slowly increasing (and not being despondent or giving up when my brain rebelled and I had to take two steps back before being able to gradually move forward again) – has gradually changed how my brain responds with regard to giving me symptoms. The overall trajectory has always been forward with improvement, even if for a lot of the time it certainly didn’t feel that way to me.

I’m kind of living proof that taking tiny steps – combining various techniques and thinking in different ways to how I used to think – in a constant‑pain situation can actually work. But if it’s not for you, then it’s not for you. There’s plenty of free material out there, such as on Dr Fanestil’s and Raelan Agle’s YouTube channels, that comes at things from different angles. I’m no Pollyanna, but something is likely to hit the spot for you. I wish you well.

Thanks so much.

 

[CalmIsTheCure]

There are some who do not avoid or can not avoid, and then what does one do?
If one could avoid that must be bliss.
If they can not or have not then what happens?
One has been told its around expecation but I myself for over a year told myself it is safe, it is TMS it can not hurt but my brain sadly does not want to listen. Sigh.

And to be completely honest when something happens over and over again, day in, day out how the heck does someone expect a different result.

Its all very frustrating

 

[feduccini]

I think it’s a bit naive or overly optimistic to always think there’s always a message behind the symptoms. I’ve made peace that I thrust my Nervous system into perpetual fight or flight and that my brain no longer trusts me.

I forgot who posted this Raelan's interview with Dr. Hansma, but at 3:50 he explains how his research shows that TMS related neurons fire even without external output. This is huge info actually since it proves symptoms happen even without triggers. This explains why there are days you're calm and happy and symptoms show up the same way. Also explains why you have symptoms, do soothing exercises, accept them, and even so they stay.

It might sound discouraging but I think there's a very good lesson in there that is: stop trying to find a reason for everything. This is pure ego and is counterproductive for mindbody healing.

I also want to point out something I find dangerous in the TMS space that is these titles like "I cured TMS in __ months". You give hope that lasts little, and pressure that stays way longer. People looking for coaches are the ones who read Sarno or similar and didn't have the book healing. I find this as damaging as the pain doctor that tells you to take injections and you'll be fine.

 

[Mani]

So what's happened is (and this happens with everyone when it comes to TMS), the fuel that makes it chronic and gives it its power is the initial belief we have that there is something wrong with us structurally. If we knew it was TMS from the beginning, it likely wouldn't have persisted.

Respectfully, that just hasnt been the truth for me. I understood from the start that my ears probably werent damaged but i was just afraid of setbacks.

These last days i was doing so great. I was trying new stuff, made friends with some airplanes and yeah i was really happy. Then i tried to pop some pills out of the tab without earplugs – something that ive done before – and i just felt my whole body breaking down again.

I felt it again, I knew my ears werent damaged, I knew i could pop them out, yet still my body completely crumpled. Afterwards my body has been responding to sounds more. And this is just some pills ya know, not someone shooting a rifle next to me. I just felt how Ive felt before. My body can just suddenly decide to not tolerate noise anymore.

And then what? Do i persist with exposure even though i have mental breakdowns and thus start creating a conditioned negative response to sound.

The answer for me will probably always be babysteps; getting to know my body.

Its just not that simple. This has been spiraling even though ive known its tms for ages.

I believe in tms but i also believe in the setbacks i know to be true

 

[Mani]

And I’ve just through lived experience learnt that when my body/brain denies sound, i cant force it. It just wont happen. I need to relax and wait to rebound. But what if rebound doesnt happen.

Ive just felt a little broken after that tab exposure thing. I was doing good there was no danger and my body suddenly said no. It just made me feel so helpless. Realization struck that it isnt as easy as it sounds

 

[CalmIsTheCure]

I forgot who posted this Raelan's interview with Dr. Hansma, but at 3:50 he explains how his research shows that TMS related neurons fire even without external output. This is huge info actually since it proves symptoms happen even without triggers. This explains why there are days you're calm and happy and symptoms show up the same way. Also explains why you have symptoms, do soothing exercises, accept them, and even so they stay.

It might sound discouraging but I think there's a very good lesson in there that is: stop trying to find a reason for everything. This is pure ego and is counterproductive for mindbody healing.

I also want to point out something I find dangerous in the TMS space that is these titles like "I cured TMS in __ months". You give hope that lasts little, and pressure that stays way longer. People looking for coaches are the ones who read Sarno or similar and didn't have the book healing. I find this as damaging as the pain doctor that tells you to take injections and you'll be fine.

I whole heartedly agree. And I find that actually the time frame stated by some people is not actually accurate.

 

[Adam Coloretti (coach)]

Respectfully, that just hasnt been the truth for me. I understood from the start that my ears probably werent damaged but i was just afraid of setbacks.

That makes sense to me if the first time it happened you both knew about TMS and knew that what you had was TMS, fair enough if so but it seems unlikely. If I was in your position and didn't know about TMS, the first handful of times it happened (really up until I got checked out or knew about TMS), I would absolutely think "what on earth is wrong with my ears?", it's human nature (there's a biological imperative to understand why it was happening and give a reason for it to yourself - you need it for survival).

I felt it again, I knew my ears werent damaged, I knew i could pop them out, yet still my body completely crumpled. Afterwards my body has been responding to sounds more. And this is just some pills ya know, not someone shooting a rifle next to me. I just felt how Ive felt before. My body can just suddenly decide to not tolerate noise anymore.

I probably thought I was out of the woods 50 times only for it to come roaring back! It's completely normal. I do note that TMS comes from the brain (it isn't a body problem), yet you have blamed your body about 5 times in this post without a single mention of the brain. I understand that you feel it in your body, but you have to be cognisant of what message that is sending to your unconscious brain (that it's a body problem).

It's probably best to allow you to respond to the first part before I go on, as my whole premise is based off of that fact being present or not

 

[feduccini]

I understood from the start that my ears probably werent damaged but i was just afraid of setbacks.

Yes, there's this issue that's kinda forgotten in TMS books and videos: fear is fear. You might not have fear of structural damage, but fear of having a psyche that simply won't be able to change itself in the way needed.

That's why I stopped watching Dan Buglio vids, they were almost always about "you're safe, there's no damage, let's breath and relax." But what about the people who know there's no damage but fear being perpetually stuck in the healing process...

 

[Adam Coloretti (coach)]

but fear of having a psyche that simply won't be able to change itself in the way needed.

What changes to the psyche are you marking as necessary to heal? Assuming that I understand you, I think this fear can be addressed through education in much the same way as fear of structural damage can be - the psyche can change just as symptom pathways can (although it may be harder to implement, granted).

But what about the people who know there's no damage but fear being perpetually stuck in the healing process...

Again, if one fully understands the healing process from a TMS perspective then I think this fear can be largely quelled. Unless (and this might be what you meant at the start), someone thinks it's impossible for themselves to work on and at all improve their perfectionism (just as an example), then yes that can be a significant barrier in my opinion.

 

[Mani]

That makes sense to me if the first time it happened you both knew about TMS and knew that what you had was TMS, fair enough if so but it seems unlikely. If I was in your position and didn't know about TMS, the first handful of times it happened (really up until I got checked out or knew about TMS), I would absolutely think "what on earth is wrong with my ears?", it's human nature (there's a biological imperative to understand why it was happening and give a reason for it to yourself - you need it for survival).

Right so first off I was like what the fucks happening. I was just watching some videos on my phone and all of a sudden i started getting annoyed at sound. It wasnt loud but just incredibly annoying.I kept turning the volume down until it was silent and went to sleep. In the days following this I kept getting worse and i was put on antibiotics or whatever to stop the inflammation hearing damage but it turned out i had no hearing loss so i had to stop medication. I just got slightly better every day. I did not know about tms back then, I just got better. One month after I was doing so well that I went on vacation with me mum. That was just too much and my symptoms and tinnitus returned after appendicitis screaming baby and some other shenanigans.

I was obviously annoyed that i had a flare/setback but i had so much faith that id get better quickly. It just did not move. After 1 week of this I found tms and bought howard schubiners book and got to work. I was getting frustrated because it took 1 or 2 months and i was exposing but my tolerance just wasnt moving at all. It took some negative comments from my folks to make me start exposing to much and went to an indoor sports gathering which was fine in the moment so i felt good about it but after my tinnitus was loud as fuck.

I just had a couple more experiences where sounds that shouldnt have been too loud caused new setbacks. There was a whole renovation being done right in front of my bedroom and i regularly woke up startled by incredibly loud noises and feel like crying. This made me feel very unsafe I still decided to not sleep with earplugs in because everyone had told me that that would be the beginning of the end. It just continued getting worse instead of better even though thats when i was doing tms work. I stopped doing a lot of those tms things because i was completely broken and very tired of being in a chronic state of stress. To be honest ive grown as a tms individual so i would probably deal with my situation better.

Ok so I like that youre asking me about this and im really curious where youre gonna go. I hope i kept it somewhat engaging and short. Thanks

 

[Rabscuttle]

I forgot who posted this Raelan's interview with Dr. Hansma, but at 3:50 he explains how his research shows that TMS related neurons fire even without external output. This is huge info actually since it proves symptoms happen even without triggers. This explains why there are days you're calm and happy and symptoms show up the same way. Also explains why you have symptoms, do soothing exercises, accept them, and even so they stay.

It might sound discouraging but I think there's a very good lesson in there that is: stop trying to find a reason for everything. This is pure ego and is counterproductive for mindbody healing.

I also want to point out something I find dangerous in the TMS space that is these titles like "I cured TMS in __ months". You give hope that lasts little, and pressure that stays way longer. People looking for coaches are the ones who read Sarno or similar and didn't have the book healing. I find this as damaging as the pain doctor that tells you to take injections and you'll be fine.

yeah the whole ‘I recovered this quick salesman gimmick’ is just totally lost on me at this point. And I say this as someone who is making huge progress, so I’m not just some jaded hopeless person lol. It’s clear there are people in this space (the greater TMS world, not necessarily this site) preying on the fear of others, whether that’s in order to benefit financially or to just fuel their ego by shaming others for doing healing wrong, either way it’s unfortunate.

frankly I think even MDs charging 1500-2k for a 90 minute TMS consultation is beyond disgusting.

I hope people in this space eventually start connecting the dots to how this monstrous economic model we are subjected to is in no small part fueling TMS by creating chronic stress on a global scale.

 

[CalmIsTheCure]

Would you like to share some tips and tricks on what is bringing about improvement for yourself? I would love to hear about what has helped you.

I have a feeling Emily had wonderful success within 2 months and that is wonderful. How truely inspiring. Im sure one saw somewhere that her ailments kept returning for a time though I could be mistaken.
I have a feeling other coaches have had the same issue also.

I think its wonderfully motivating to see healing does not have to take years to happen. I love that. However sometimes I think perhaps some folks become a little frightened when their particular problem hasn't gone in that time. This is where horrific doubt can start to seep into the process.

Coaches are wonderful people for spreading the word. After all this is an important message. And one more people ought to know about.

As I say this thread was never meant to become a place to ridicule someone. One genuinly was looking for an answer to a question.

I will day that perhaps I do get triggered easily by some things coaches post.
.

 

[Rabscuttle]

Would you like to share some tips and tricks on what is bringing about improvement for yourself? I would love to hear about what has helped you.

I have a feeling Emily had wonderful success within 2 months and that is wonderful. How truely inspiring. Im sure one saw somewhere that her ailments kept returning for a time though I could be mistaken.
I have a feeling other coaches have had the same issue also.

I think its wonderfully motivating to see healing does not have to take years to happen. I love that. However sometimes I think perhaps some folks become a little frightened when their particular problem hasn't gone in that time. This is where horrific doubt can start to seep into the process.

Coaches are wonderful people for spreading the word. After all this is an important message. And one more people ought to know about.

As I say this thread was never meant to become a place to ridicule someone. One genuinly was looking for an answer to a question.

I will day that perhaps I do get triggered easily by some things coaches post.
.

who are you replying to Calm?

 

[CalmIsTheCure]

who are you replying to Calm?

You my friend