1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Our TMS drop-in chat is tomorrow (Saturday) from 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM Eastern (***NOTE*** now on US Daylight Time). It's a great way to get quick and interactive peer support, with Steve2 as your host. Look for the red Chat flag on top of the menu bar!

TMS connection with eye issues?

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Dee, Apr 17, 2013.

  1. Dee

    Dee New Member

    I'm so glad I posted this two years ago and that it's helping people identify another symptom of TMS that we might not recognize as symptoms. The brain is a very powerful thing! Best of luck to you Seanpat! And thanks for replying to this thread! That made my day!
     
  2. Bodhigirl

    Bodhigirl Well known member

    I am so grateful to read this thread. My back "tried" to go out on Thursday and I chose to be active and nurture my soul instead. But by Friday, I was getting pain in my left eye. I had a real eye infection a few weeks ago for the first time in years and treated it successfully with eyedrops. I think it gave my TMS the great idea to give me more eye pain. There has been enormous stress: my husband's mom died last week, we traveled east for the funeral. Our eldest dog is in poor health and needs a lot of caregiving. I watch the anxiety, anger and tension ebb and flow while continuing to meditate, exercise and practice daily yoga and pelvic floor stretches, to keep tension from building up but mostly I am just honest with myself about how angry I can get, how resentful and seemingly sensitive and petty I can feel: just plain ungrateful and whiny.
    I am weary of the challenges of the TMS. After 30 years of a psychospiritual journey, I am just weary of being so awake to myself. Yet, when I check out, I get symptomatic. Like this eye thing.
    Just glad I joined in last year, when my IC had kicked up and I knew it had to be related to Sarno's back theory... so grateful to listen to all of you. I'm hopeful whatever this eye irritation is, that it passes as I rest and own up to the tension and anger below my surface.
     
  3. Ryan79

    Ryan79 Peer Supporter

    As an optometrist, I hear a lot complaints that have no structural basis. Twitchy eyelids are some of the most common things people complain about that have no abnormality present. Or flashes of light that last for a second of two. Most optometry journals estimate that 50-60% of patients have dry eyes. Some patients have visible dry eyes through the slit lamp, and have absolutely no complaints, because their mind is not focused on it 24/7.

    Eye pain is another great masquerader that causes complaints but really nothing is wrong. 98% of the time outside of an obvious infection, or redness to the eye nothing is physically wrong.

    Furthermore between the ages of 20-60 most patients think they need "stronger" glasses. Most Rx's in this age category change very little, but they just associate the visit to the eye doctor with worse vision. Also patients are perplexed when you tell them that their Rx has decreased because their last doctor over prescribed the Rx just to make them happy. If you tell them nothing has changed they seem unsatisfied, and start acquiring multiple pairs of glasses from multiple doctors.

    Also I examine a lot of children under the age of 10, that really do not need glasses. If you have children say to you're eye doctor that it's ok if you feel like my child doesn't need glasses.

    I always tell patients that Lasik comes down to two main factors: money and fear (assuming you're a good candidate). Keratoconus is a condition that Lasik doctor's are obsessive about ruling out before preforming Lasik, and the fact it wasn't in Steve's case is odd. I wouldn't recommend Lasik to an obsessively worried patient.
     
    Bodhigirl likes this.
  4. Bodhigirl

    Bodhigirl Well known member

    Argh, wrote a reply when I was not logged in and it disappeared after logging in. Just wanted to thank the group! Went to sleep last night, telling my unconscious to bring on the anger and grief because the magic trick of eye pain or any other pain didn't fly with me any more. THERE IS NO WHITE RABBIT IN THE HAT!

    Then I dreamed I kept forgetting my keys and getting locked out of my house. I had to stand in the dark yard, waiting for my husband to come home and let me in.

    There is no rescue from the unconscious self, from living in this body. I have to go back in the house! I did, and awakened without symptoms.
    Just for today, you guys, just for today. Grateful.
     
    Shirley and JanAtheCPA like this.
  5. Jay Bee

    Jay Bee Newcomer

    Hi all,



    i would like to hear your opinion, and get help,
    i been having EYE issues for the past 11 years, yes 11 years none stop, i went to check it out a few times, all doctors say the same, they see NOTHING.
    feeling tightness in both eyes, as well my neck, head, over time i became so obsessive to the pain that every move i give all day i observe my eyes, it became part of my life, BIG part, i go on with work, family and all, its just something that takes u most of my brain, thoughts, worry, etc.

    i found Dr. Sarno , TMS,
    i felt this is me and finally i have hope,
    i read the book, listened to a lecture, i understand TMS fully,
    here is my issue, i been trying to distract from my eyes and not worrying or thinking of it, which i understand it the key of success, but NO luck, eyes are all of my my brain, its been 11 years, how do i change my train of thought process, to stop focusing on the eyes 24/7 ? eyes are also the main focal of us, its a main organ, my brain is simply stuk on it,

    i feel like i am losing it, it does not get any better and i understand its because i don't distract and am still obsessed, which gives food for my subconscious mind, :(


    any thoughts ? past experience ?

    thank you

    Jay
     
  6. seanpat

    seanpat New Member

    Jay,
    I feel your pain. I have had probably 30-40 different TMS symptoms over past 7 years. They bounce around as I deal with one another pops up to distract me from myself. They will even repeat if enough time has gone by since I last defeated them. The symptom imperative (as Dr. Sarno calls it) is real and can be relentless. My current (new one) is fear of diabetes so that almost every time I eat something (especially candy) I have a panic attack which can also mimic a low blood sugar episode. As I am typing these words I begin to get short of breath which is proof positive it is TMS. My feelings always follow my thoughts. Always. At a subconscious level (not very deep in my case) it is always repression that causes my symptoms. Many times I cannot identify what I am repressing but most of the time it is something right in front of me. Last night it was I didn't want to go out for dinner but I went and had horrible anxiety the whole time until dinner was finished and I knew I was about to leave and the anxiety left me. Only then did I realize what the cause of my anxiety was. I have had your specific complaint about eyes, neck, head etc about 50 times. For some reason this one is one of the easiest for me to deal with because I have no DOUBT it is TMS and as I soon as acknowledge that fact it begins to subside. Back and shoulder pain are the same way with me. They come and go and are very easy for me to accept as TMS. I have come to believe that it is symptoms that I interpret as an existential threat that scare me the most. That is, if I think it is a heart attack, stroke, MS, diabetes etc this will get my attention the fastest. Steve O and Sarno, both talk about this and Sarno believes (I think) that all TMS in the world, diagnosed and undiagnosed is related to our frustration with our own mortality. We are all going to die and deep down inside we don't like that very much. If we say it out loud we sound immature so we don't really acknowledge it because we know it sounds crazy to deny something so obvious. This is classic repression and my belief is at at some level all TMS is repression of this basic fact. Something that threatens our very existence is behind all TMS symptoms. Our reptilian brain cares only about a couple of things both related to survival. Staying alive and procreating. Anything that triggers (real or imagined) our existence, our livelihood, our family, our self worth etc etc triggers a reptilian response (could be fight or flight as we see in panic attacks-adrenaline/cortisol etc) which in turn triggers physical symptoms. You mentioned distraction as a way to deal with your obsession with your eyes and this is a double edged sword in my experience. If you try to manufacture a distraction it makes the issue worse in my experience. If you naturally get distracted and notice 10 minutes or an hour later "hey the symptoms has disappeared or diminished substantially" that is great. It is the proof I need that this is indeed TMS. Remember that DOUBT is our problem. It is the disease. Until I internalize and believe my symptoms are HARMLESS then they continue and they bounce around. As long as there is any question about me being in danger I am at risk of a TMS symptom. Hope is also very important. Your symptoms will go away if you keep at it and remove the doubt. If one thing is not working try something else. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. I do this all the time unfortunately...I know this was long but I hope it helps.
     
    readytoheal and JanAtheCPA like this.
  7. Jay Bee

    Jay Bee Newcomer

    Hi,

    Indeed a great help, thank you so much for sharing so many experiences, I saw myself right there in many areas that I never noticed before,

    I'm hundred percent for certain that it's just TMS,

    the problem is that after going by a day or two and the symptoms are not getting any better I'm starting to doubt again maybe it's not the TMS because it should have gotten better ... and then of course the symptoms getting worse...
    Seems like a war, struggle, that I'm not sure which way to fight, or not to, what kind of language does our subconscious speak? I can try all different ways.. Willing to finally get rid of this one for good,

    interesting that you mention that when you have eye pain it's easy for you to deal with it, knowing for sure its TMS, while I found it hard, being most TMS are on the back area,
    On the other hand I just read that all our eye muscles, nerves are connected to the neck, my entire head and neck are also full of pain , feeling tightness, helps me believe and being convinced it's TMS, but why isn't it getting any better, I know already its not harmful, I'm still obsessed, I watch it all day, :(

    Maybe it's because I've been having this for that many years? It takes longer to re direct the mind,

    Any thoughts?

    JAY
     
  8. seanpat

    seanpat New Member

    Jay, how is your sleep? I have noticed mine TMS is always worse with lack of sleep. Regarding your eyes, I don't know what your do for a living but at some level the TMS symptoms are being used by our psyche for something...The reason I think my TMS symptoms are recurring is that they work-that is- they serve some purpose that my mind thinks is helpful. Last night it was as simple of giving me an excuse not to go to dinner. I routinely have TMS symptoms creep up when I have something in the future I don't really want to do. I am chronically responsible for everything/everyone in my life and this causes me problems. The TMS gives me an out. I don't really want to be responsible for everything in my world but I feel like I am/should be or am I a bad person/people won't like me/I won't be a good catholic/husband/father/employer/son/brother, etc etc etc. This is at the root of my issues and I suspect most with TMS. This is the "do goodism" personality that Sarno talks about and the truth is it pisses us off but we can't say it for all of the above reasons. We have boundary issues, in my case mostly of my own creation. So to give some practical advice on why your eyes rather that some other part of your body, I suspect if you dig deep enough it will become clear. Sarno always said it doesn't matter why and to some extent I find that to be true. Once I acknowledge and internalize it is TMS it usually goes away rather quickly. It is helpful to me, however, to know the why, because once I know the why, I can internalize the truth, that it is TMS. Merry Christmas...
     
    JanAtheCPA likes this.
  9. JanAtheCPA

    JanAtheCPA Beloved Grand Eagle

    Jay Bee, these are absolutely awesome responses for you, from seanpat. I agree with Sean 100% that fear of death and rage at the inevitability of our mortality, is a HUGE factor in most, if not all, negative human behavior as well as our physical response, ie TMS. In addition to that, we all carry around the repressed childhood rage that was the basis of Freud's theories, and which Dr. Sarno fully believes is at the root of TMS.

    You say you understand TMS fully, but you don't say anything about what you have done to start exploring your repressed negative emotions. Most of us who land here do so because just understanding TMS is not enough. We have to "do the work", and we have to accept the fact that we will continue to do the work the rest of our lives, because the unconscious mechanism of repression will continue to happen, resulting in more symptoms, new symptoms, or the conditioned return of old symptoms. Sadly, this is because that's what our brains were designed to do, for all of the reasons that Sean laid out so well.

    I urge you to do the free Structured Educational Program on our wiki, and when you do the writing exercises, to do them with complete and unrestricted honesty. This is not easy, because your brain will give you all kinds of messages to hold you back from being honest. Remember, this is a survival mechanism, it thinks it's doing you a favor, but your poor brain thinks you are still living in a cave with real mortal danger surrounding you - and this is not serving you well in our modern age.

    Good luck, Jay Bee, I hope you'll do the SEP and that we'll see your posts as you proceed.

    ~Jan
     
    Pietro Carloni likes this.
  10. JanAtheCPA

    JanAtheCPA Beloved Grand Eagle

    I should never forget this - for every time someone claims that they don't have any repressed negative emotions - D'oh! This certainly was (and still is) one of my biggies!
     
  11. FredAmir

    FredAmir Well known member

    Thanks Dee and others for sharing your stories.

    Eliminating my reading glasses and how it happened came as a complete surprise to me. I had recovered rapidly from pain in my back, neck, legs, knees, arms, hands, and total disability and had improved so much that I was taking karate classes when I went for an eye exam. Here's what I wrote in my log in Ch. 4 of Rapid Recovery from Back and Neck Pain:

    Friday, May 7
    I was examined by an ophthalmologist for my first eye exam since I had moved. For fourteen years I had been diagnosed as slightly farsighted with astigmatism in the left eye and needing glasses for reading. Now the ophthalmologist diagnosed me as slightly nearsighted and not needing any glasses. Because I felt that he had hurried through the examination and because his diagnosis contradicted those of five other optometrists and an ophthalmologist, I called the clinic for another examination. This time another ophthalmologist examined me and gave the same diagnosis. “You are young and there is no reason why you should need glasses,” the doctor said. I was glad, but puzzled!

    Could it be that at some point in my life, as a result of tension, my eyes had not been at their best on the day they were examined, so that the optometrist prescribed glasses for me, which I then became conditioned to require? I usually could read for a few minutes before my eyes felt strained, and once, when my glasses were lost for three weeks, I developed headaches and eyestrain when I had to read. But now, armed with my newly gained knowledge about tension's effects and assurances from two doctors, I began to read without glasses and experienced no problems. In fact, I have not needed eyeglasses since.[72]

    Later I remembered the circumstances under which I had to get my first glasses. When I finished my course in psychology, I had tried to resolve my parents' conflicts and bring some peace and harmony to our lives. However, my efforts were not appreciated and caused even more problems. During this very tense period I began to experience eyestrain and headaches while studying, which resulted in a visit to the optometrist and my reading glasses.

    [72]Later I discovered Dr. William Bates's book Better Eyesight Without Glasses (New York: Henry Holt, 1971), in which he explains the incorrect diagnosis and approach by the medical establishment to eye refractions. Using simultaneous retinoscopy, he was able to demonstrate in thousands of patients that tension can cause an error in refraction (e.g., nearsightedness). In fact, he points out that the lens has very little to do with the refraction error. It is the eye muscles that shorten or lengthen the eye for better vision. I found Dr. Bates’ arguments to be almost exactly the same as Dr. Sarno's, except that Dr. Bates' apply to the eye instead of the back. He says to ignore all the dos and don'ts, such as the advice not to read in dim light, and with a relaxed mind, an active imagination, and a number of eye exercises, one can get rid of the need for glasses. Of course, I would add that ordering one's mind to relax the eyes for better vision helps too. I highly recommend Dr. Bates’ book; I also recommend The Art of Seeing by Aldous Huxley, a man who suffered from near-blindness and, using Dr. Bates' methods, recovered completely.
    ________________________________________________________________________________

    More than 20 years has past. I am 54 now and still do not wear reading glasses or any kind of glasses. When I notice any blurriness in my vision I know that it is from tension and I apply some of my strategies to improve it. Will I need glasses at some point? I tend to focus on what is possible. So my focus is on never needing glasses. I have a friend who is 65 and still does not wear glasses. So it is possible.

    If you have to wear something to see more clearly, try pinhole glasses. They work by focusing rays of light on the retina and work for nearsightedness as well as farsightedness. They are very inexpensive and unlike lenses you do not have to keep changing to higher magnifications. DO NOT DRIVE with pinhole glasses. Hard to have full view of the road.

    Join me next month to design your own Rapid Recovery plan and see how it can help you conquer TMS and its many manifestations.
     
  12. lexylucy

    lexylucy Well known member

    Thanks s much for your post!! what a brilliant discovery. I think it is something that may help people for sure as eye problems are common and uncomfortable contacts can be triggering.
    What a nod to Sarno and his work.

    I myself am also celebrating a year at having found the tools I needed on this forum, and through reading Sarno's books and watching/reading success stories, to find relief from both pain and stress.

    Merry Christmas and have a wonderful New Year!

    LexyLucy
     
    JanAtheCPA likes this.
  13. wonderwoman

    wonderwoman Peer Supporter

    I am 64. I do not wear reading glasses.
     
  14. Jay Bee

    Jay Bee Newcomer

    Jan,

    i am sorry for responding so late, i was away for the holidays and all, just reading all responses, awesome and helpful,
    to your question:
    all i have done in terms to my rage was to talk once a day to my self about anger and repressed emotions, (which i believe to be it)
    i never heard of that program, i will take a deep look into it,

    all i have done overall was understanding the TMS, trying to let the fear of doing things go away, for 11 years i am afraid and holding back of fear i will damage my eyes for good.. its real hard, its still on me 24/7 and as much i am trying to distract it keeps coming up over and over, trying to forget makes the pain easier but the minute i THINK of trying to distract the thoughts are back,.... seems like a no ending war, i can use guidness how to handle this part,
    i understood that by just understanding its all TMS and nothing more the pain will start making its way out, but that doesn't seem the case yet.

    Jay
     
  15. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    For eye issues Roberto Kaplan's approach is complementary to TMS. I read a couple of his books years ago and found them fascinating, helpful and comforting. Here's a quote from his Home Page:

    "It is the brain that controls your eyes. Your thoughts and emotions determine how the brain is directed. So, when you are controlled by fear or conditioned from the past, your eyes let in less light and even distort the light energy. Doctors in turn measure this as eye conditions or disease."

    http://www.beyond2020vision.com/
     
  16. Laleah Shoo Shoo

    Laleah Shoo Shoo Peer Supporter

    Hi everybody,

    I've read several of your posts (not all) and took notice of Steve Ozanich's specifically, as it had to do with laser surgery. Hi Steve, i can't say enough about the book you've written, i work with it daily.
    I had laser surgery for narrow angle glaucoma. Without this surgery, i would have lost my eyesight. This happened out of the blue ~ was visiting an eye doctor for a regular examination and was told about the narrow angle glaucoma and if not attended to, i would go blind. I was shocked, to say the least. At any rate, this laser surgery called Iridotomy, was done soon enough and needed to be repeated twice more over a year's period of time, as the perforations were closing. This all occurred five years ago.
    Ever since this laser iridotomy surgery, i have (much of the time, as i do while typing this) throbbing pain in my eyes, both eyes. Any Opthomologist i have seen since the surgeries has told me they haven't heard of such a symptom or reaction to this type of procedure. It occurred to me the pain may be coming from the nerves in the eyes..as a possible reaction to the entire debacle. I had been kept waiting a couple of months for this iridotomy, having been told i could possibly lose my sight while waiting! Oh dear. Anyway.......Most of the time, i ignore this throbbing pain when it arises, usually happens during the night....today it's staying with me as i'm awake and upright. (often when lying down). As well, my eyes throb with Light...wearing sunglasses outdoors most of the time.
    I sound like a real case! haha I'm smiling :)

    I was put on a wait list to see a Corneal Specialist, as the last optometrist i saw, suggested this might be the problem.

    I have been living with chronic debilitating pain for three years now, and have improved GREATLY since truly understanding and absolutely believing in TMS as being the cause. Well now, that's another story entirely, how this pain 'took over' my life one day July 2014. And perhaps i will post about that some other time. I am appalled at the ignorance rampant in the medical profession, that perpetuates this pain epidemic without any awareness in mind-body connection. It baffles me! So, for now, any feedback about the pain in the eyes, would be so much appreciated.
    I wonder if this could be TMS effect....yet, why would it occur when lying down, during sleep.....waking up with it.
    Do others have pain in their eyes due to light?

    Okey dokey, thank you for taking the time to read this
    and blessings to you all!
    ciao for niao ;-)

    LindaLeah
     
  17. Laleah Shoo Shoo

    Laleah Shoo Shoo Peer Supporter

    P.S. I realize i wasn't clear ~ I am referring to the eyes in this post. The chronic pain i mentioned living with this past three years has nothing to do with the eyes.

    Okay, thank you!
     
  18. KenDenmark

    KenDenmark Newcomer

    Hi!
    My eye pain starter to get servere 2010 when I as an escape from my work took an education as driving teacher! In that period it became cronic ! I’ve had asthma Not good as an pro trumpet player which after about 10 years disappears over night when a doctor told me I didn’t have it! Heel spur- gone , digestive troubles- shoulder pain- gone , a lot skin issues as child and young all gone !! And in august after my father died and we decided to get an divorce
    my eye pain got incredibly worse I finally with help found out that I’ve got TMS!! Looking back I see that my pain always feels ncreases in stressful times and doctors always told me that the pain I describe doesn’t match what they see... and trying everything that can be done to dry eyes .. nothing helped!!!
    But still struggling believing 100 % in TMS .. in good days I’m convinst but bad days so much doubting!and anxiety strikes back!
    I’m sure better than for months ago but my brain is controlling too much... any good advice to move on fr here
     
  19. KenDenmark

    KenDenmark Newcomer

    Totally like me!! Eyes are my windows can not distract from the eye issues try to be indifferent but my brain constantly circles around the eye pain
     

Share This Page