1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
    Dismiss Notice

When I was 13

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by didi sharp, Jun 9, 2015.

  1. didi sharp

    didi sharp New Member

    I began having back problems when I was 13. There was a tremendous amount of emotional turmoil and dysfunction in my house. I was actually told by a doctor early on that I would always have back problems because I was tall. I was 5"9" tall, but I believed him. I was 13! I would have periodic episodes when my back "went out". Terrible pain, couldn't move. I was told I had ruptured discs, slipped discs, etc. Just go to bed with ice and/or heat etc. I was out of town once and doing a fence project for my mother. It was the day before July 4th, the day my Dad died. I ended up flat on the floor unable to move. My friend suggested I see her Reiki friend. What the hell...ok, I'll go. While on the table a huge outpouring of grief came out of me. That was my first hint there was something going on besides a physical issue. Fast forward many years and somehow I got Healing Back Pain by Dr. Sarno. It just clicked and I have not had anything but a twinge or two here and there. I realized it was where I was storing all my grief and anger. So now when I notice that twinge I ask myself what am I angry about or sad about and just breathe. That was in my early 50's. Then I went through a painful 3 year period of time where a mentally ill neighbor targeted my family and me in particular. Constant harassment, photographing and videoing us. It got really bad. We had to go to court 3 times and eventually got a permanent restraining order. During this time I began to have lots of pain in my legs. Walking any amount of time was very painful. Also standing for any amount of time or sitting in any chair but my recliner was very painful. I did not know about symptom imperative at that time so I've spent the last 12 years or so going from doctor to doctor, being diagnosed with bursitis, sciatica, inflamed poas muscle, getting orthotics etc. You get the picture. Only recently did I think to myself this is TMS and reread Mind/Body Prescription. I'm not sure why it took me so long to make the connection. So I have been journaling and realizing how much buried anger and fear I have. Working on that. It has helped somewhat, but I am still taking advil a few times a day. It's sort of baffling to me that my back issue seemed to disappear effortlessly, yet this leg pain thing seems to be hanging on. I talk to my brain and tell it to cut it out. That I don't need the distraction etc. I have been able to "ignore" the pain much more than I was before. So that's good that I am not so focused on it. I appreciate this site tremendously. I've learned a lot from reading the forums and particularly found Alan Gordon's site helpful. So any advice etc would be appreciated. It's good to know I'm not alone or nuts.
    IrishSceptic likes this.
  2. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi, Didi sharp. I know where you've been because I was there, too.
    Your telling about the nut neighbor who made your life hell reminds me of when I owned a two-flat
    and rented it to a couple who made my life hell. They destroyed the house and then reported to the city that
    it was unsafe to live in. The local ordinances actually allowed them to get away with that, and to continue
    living there without paying rent as I had to have repairs made. Then before the next inspection they
    did more damage. This went on until I finally learned who their former landlord was and phoned him in
    California. He said they had done the same to his house and the only way I could stop the madness was to
    have them evicted. The night before their eviction they did more damage. But I was finally rid of them.

    I had to ask my sister for some Librium to help me cope with the stress.

    It took awhile, but I finally got so I could stop thinking about the nuts.

    You have to accept that bad things can happen to good people and ask the Lord to forgive them,
    even if you can't forgive them yourself.

    I suggest that if you have not done so yet, start the Structured Educational Program which is free
    in the subforum on this web site. It helps us to discover the TMS emotional reasons for our pain,
    Journaling helped me to discover mine.

    Also, read the success stories in that subforum here, and watch TouTube videos of people who had
    TMS pain and healed.
    JenV likes this.
  3. didi sharp

    didi sharp New Member

    Thanks Walt. I appreciate your comments. I struggled with forgiving my neighbor for a long time, but knowing he is mentally ill helped me see him with some compassion. After we got the restraining order many years ago we have peacefully coexisted. Now my legs need to get the message!
  4. tattvamasi

    tattvamasi Peer Supporter

    As you can see, it does not really matter what exactly causes your unconscious rage. If it did matter, you would be free of pain or at least have reduced pain. The mere knowledge of the fact that you have unconscious rage, due to many, many, and I would say many more things that you will NEVER be able to fully make a list of, is all that you need. Dr. Sarno has stated many times that you do not have to change yourself, and in fact you probably even can't change yourself if you really wanted to, to get rid of TMS. He says that knowledge is what is ultimately going to cure you. And the knowledge what is meant by that statement is the simple knowledge of the fact that you have unconscious feelings that are dangerous and that your brain creates pain as a distraction to keep you from experiencing these feelings. That's it. There is really nothing else you need to know about TMS. Doing all this psychological work is a fun thing to do, but ultimately you have to come to this very moment and realize that YOU are keeping the pain alive. No one else is responsible for your pain. You need to realize how exactly are you feeding the pain, moment by moment. Take a look at your life and see how this pain makes you do things you wouldn't do otherwise, to avoid doing things that you would do otherwise, and to feel bad and uncomfortable. If you are able to realize how the pain really has you, you can gradually learn to let go.
    plum likes this.
  5. David88

    David88 Well known member

    Not everyone is cured just by knowing about TMS. Sarno makes that clear.

    People who have been on the symptom imperative ride all their lives, whose pain comes from a traumatic childhood, generally must do the psychological work, or the symptoms will continue. Healing from TMS becomes a life-changing process, and change happens through healing the psychological pain.
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
    JenV and fneal like this.
  6. tattvamasi

    tattvamasi Peer Supporter

    Traumatic childhood experiences clearly cause lasting psychological change in people, causing them to be stuck in an anxiety/fear mindset (also what is called a perfectionism/goodism personality trait). As Dr. Sarno has discovered, this very mindset is what is causing mindbody disorders. Yes, Dr. Sarno also lists childhood experience and life stressors as a cause of unconscious rage, but think about it, would it still be the case if you weren't a perfectionist/goodist? How can life pressures cause unconscious rage if you are a person who just doesn't take life so seriously, if you are not a perfectionist/goodist at all? You see, this personality trait of being a perfectionist/goodist, which I would also call an anxiety/fear mindset, is ALWAYS the cause of unconscious rage.

    Now, it is important to realize that if you are a perfectionist, goodist, and simply a constantly worrying, controlling, unable to relax individual, then YOU are doing all this in this present moment. You can either dive into your past and try to figure out what made you be this way, but you have to see that you are STILL doing it. You might not be aware HOW exactly are you doing it like you are not aware of how you are beating your heart or circulating your blood. So it is incorrect to say "people, whose pain comes from a traumatic childhood". The pain can not come from your childhood, it is impossible. Your childhood is over, you are living in the present moment and there is NO escape from it. Your childhood is over, how can it cause you pain? Obviously it can't. It is YOU who is causing your pain, by still being like you were as a child, by still having the anxiety/fear mindset. Yes, you learned to be that way as a child, due to some circumstances, but YOU are the one who is keeping this anxiety/fear alive right here, right now, you can not blame your past for this. Your past is only an excuse for you to continue being that way. And by not being aware of how you do it, does not mean that you aren't doing it.

    People can only change when they become aware that what they want to change is not out of their control, that they actually are doing it themselves. By becoming aware of this fact, you can change what you are doing. It's like breathing, it goes on automatically most of the time. Your breathing might be shallow, you might hold your breath without even knowing you are doing it. Once you realize it, and once you see that YOU are doing it, you can gently change it and then the new, consciously modified breathing pattern will sink in and will become the new automatic pattern.
    Heavenly, plum, Kati and 3 others like this.
  7. Buckeye

    Buckeye Peer Supporter

    @tattvamasi wrote "Your childhood is over, how can it cause you pain? Obviously it can't."

    Wow... glad that's settled... now, I can quit that SEP and all the other work I've been struggling with. I'm just too stupid to quit being like I was as a child and quit having an anxiety/fear mindset. I'll just order a new mindset on Amazon and not have to deal with all this psychological stuff. Wish I would have thought of that earlier!

    And, I've thought long and hard about this post... the mods are free to delete this if they want... but, that post just really makes me angry right now because it comes across as really flippant and condescending. Maybe I'm the only one that takes it that way... maybe I'm just being a baby... Right now, I'm just crawling out from under several days of severe pain and I'm not in the best mood. But, I think, even if I were perfectly fine, I would still take issue with the way that post comes off.
    Markus and David88 like this.
  8. tattvamasi

    tattvamasi Peer Supporter

    And that's exactly what I'm talking about. The mindset that creates the pain cannot in any way cure it. If you think that fighting against the pain works so well, then why are you here? You said you've been struggling with the work. You're struggling with it only because you don't understand the key element in overcoming TMS. You are in pain because you don't understand. And part of you doesn't even want you to understand, that is why you get angry. If this information was just useless and stupid, you would just dismiss it, you wouldn't get angry at my post. You need to realize that this is nothing but your own unconscious defense mechanism that is doing the best it can to keep you from finding out what TMS is really about. If you don't allow yourself to see things in a new way, you will remain in pain. I'm sorry to put it that way, but it's the truth.

    Please don't get me wrong. Being in pain is terrible and I really want to help you. But if I gave you just more information on how to fight it, you would get deeper and deeper into the trap. If I said you need years of psychotherapy because of your childhood, it would just give you a reason to stay in pain for more years. Do you really want for it to take that long? If you do, you can go that route, it is your decision. But if you are fed up with the pain, you need to face the truth about TMS and about yourself. To get out of the trap you need to understand that what you have been doing all along is exactly what is keeping you in pain.
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2015
    Heavenly, plum and Tennis Tom like this.
  9. Buckeye

    Buckeye Peer Supporter

    @tattvamasi my 'anger' was in your condescension toward a forum member who is seeking help. But, you believe what ever it is that makes you feel good.

    But, part of your post hit the nail on the head. I had been here months ago and found this forum useful. But, if the character has changed to posts like your post, you are correct. I have no more use to be here and had already told that exact same thing to someone in private yesterday. Your posts are incredibly arrogant and you have yet to even tell any part of your story. Clearly, if this is what "TMS" is... then, I have no use for it. Good luck with your quest to prove what ever it is that you are so desperately trying to prove.
  10. Forest

    Forest Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi, folks,

    This thread has gone downhill, so I've locked it so that people can step back and reflect a bit. I'm not going to delete any content because I want people to see how rapidly things can escalate to a level that harms the community.

    As a forum admin, there are certain things I can control and certain things I can't control. I generally look to implement policies to guide my administrative actions, and the relevant policies here are those against writing in an inflammatory manner and also against making things personal.

    First, writing in an inflammatory manner. To preface this, let me say that I thought that this was a very interesting thread. The last thing that you want in a forum is for it to become boring with no new ideas. As the person who founded this community and has administered it since 2008, I'm loving that discussions are taking place at such a high level by people who clearly have a deep knowledge of what they are talking about.

    I've said before that in terms of the ideas that people express in on-topic posts, this is pretty much a free speech zone. However, the way in which we express opinions is regulated on this forum. Please recognize that different people have different opinions. Everyone has the right to their own opinion, and when someone states their own opinion as fact, it can feel like a slap in the face if that opinion contradict's your own. Things can rapidly escalate, which is why it is so easy for flame wars to break out online.

    To make things concrete, if there is reason to believe that other people may disagree, with what you are writing, express your opinion as your opinion rather than as an absolute fact. It's really not hard to do, and it makes the other person feel more respected if you acknowledge that they may be right.

    To be clear, if you express your ideas in a respectful and non-inflammatory manner, you're welcome to your own opinion about mindbody phenomena. People may not like it, but if you state your opinion respectfully, without making absolute statements and while acknowledging that others may disagree, you're welcome to say what you like. When in doubt, err on the side of being respectful. It's really not that hard and people will like you much more if you do.

    The second rule is to not make things personal. We are here to discuss mindbody phenomena, and talk about other people's behavior just creates what forum administrators refer to as "drama." Discussions of other people's behavior rapidly escalates to personal attacks and permanent or long term hatred is born. So please keep threads on-topic, discussing mind-body phenomena rather than people's behavior. If you have a problem with someone's behavior, just send me a personal message as the administrator and I'll take care of it according to the policies of the community (with some judgment applied).

    Thank you for your understanding, everyone. I'm going to keep this thread locked until tomorrow some time and then will unlock it in case people want to continue on-topic and respectful discussion. We are a relatively young community that is still learning the rules, so I have not deleted any content or issued any warnings or permanent or temporary bans.

    See you in the other threads!
    plum likes this.
  11. Orion2012

    Orion2012 Well known member

    Last night, prior to reading this thread, I was journaling and had what seemed liked an important revelation: I have been addicted to emotional pain for a long time.

    Only in the past six months, since by my back injury (which I'm sure has long since healed), have I been using physical pain to torture myself.

    Starting at age 16, after my mom's two-year battle with terminal cancer, I embarked on a series of unhealthy relationships, often times in the form of lusting after ladies who were emotionally (or completely) unavailable. I was largely uninterested in women who treated me well. To get my full attention, a girl needed to play hard to get, dump, or cheat on me. Now, somehow, I am many years into a stable, healthy, and mostly drama-free relationship.

    Recognizing that I have been unconsciously seeking pain for a long time seems like a major breakthrough to me. For this reason, I feel that tattvamasi highlights a truly important point: We are the one's creating and sustaining our pain, and only through accepting this are we empowered to change it. However, I would have never have come to this conclusion without taking the time to reflect on my past. While I agree with the importance of accountability for the present, it would be be a mistake to discount the insight that examining our past can reveal.

    So, I really appreciate all the perspectives expressed above. I am grateful to all with the courage to share their thoughts and feelings.

    My apologies to didi sharp for continuing to hijack the thread, but the above discussion resonated with my recent revelations and I felt the need to speak my peace. Welcome aboard!
    plum likes this.
  12. Forest

    Forest Beloved Grand Eagle

    Thanks for posting that, @Orion2012. Having managed this forum since 2009, I can't tell you how often I've seen that it is the people who write most passionately that seem to reach people. Not everyone likes what they have to say, of course, but I often see posts like yours talking about how much they were helped by posts like @tattvamasi 's.

    That is what a good forum is about: the exchange of ideas by people who are passionate about a subject. We won't always like what we read, but we can always go on to the next post or next thread. But if we do so, I think it's our own loss, as often we learn the most by seriously engaging with people who we disagree with the most. Even if we disagree 100%, at least we learn better why we disagree. Indeed, this is what I love the most about forums and why I keep coming back after 6 years and tens of thousands of posts.

    That's why I always emphasize freedom of thought in my posts regarding administrative actions of this sort. The forum is just better when there is an open exchange of ideas (as long as it is done in a respectful, non-harassing, and non-campaigning sort of manner, I will do my best to ensure that).
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2015
    plum and Orion2012 like this.

Share This Page