Why you probably have TMS

[Diana-M]

Best 8 minute video explaining why people get TMS. Does it apply to you, too? It applies to me, big time.

“The body will speak to you loud and clear. The body will say no when you’re not saying no.”

“We can look on these difficulties as problems, or as teachings to bring us back to ourselves.”

—Gabor Mate, MD, Author of When the Body Says No

 

[Blue_Man]

Yes I watched that video and I can't say it made me feel better lol. Like oh perfectionist types who always put themselves last or are overly nice (although I hesitate to say I'm such a great person tbh) are more likely to die of cancer?
Like that's effing great lol cancer is the #1 thing I worry about.
Out of all my TMS symptoms I finally am struggling with one I can't seem to shake, the constantly gas, gurgling, acid reflux that happens esp at night damaging my esophagus and I keep thinking about esophageal caner.
There are times during the day when I'm at work or occupied and I feel almost normal, but it's hard to shake the reminders every time I burp that it's there and a threat.
I don't know how to deal with it, should I just become a complete a-hole and try not to care about anyone else or anything? I'm not sure that's a feasible option even if I tried.

 

[Diana-M]

Oh, sorry it made you feel worse! For some reason, it really felt good to me. It Spoke to me. It made me feel that I just need to find the things my inner Self is concerned about me overdoing, and put an end to them. Learn to say, no.” As far as the cancer reference, (glass half full,) I thought, “0h good. All I got was TMS! There’s still hope for me!”

Sorry to hear about your TMS symptoms. I think the answer is to keep searching and keep working, until you crack the code causing yours. That’s what I’m doing, anyway.

 

[JanAtheCPA]

I'm with you, @Diana-M. When the Body Says No, by Dr Mate, is my #3 recovery book behind The Divided Mind and Hope and Help for Your Nerves. But WtBSN scares some people instead of inspiring them. Welcome to Team Inspiration, my friend

@Blue-Man, courage in the face of what scares us is one of the 180-degree mindset flips that is essential for recovery. Simple in concept, not always easy in practice. The TMS fear mechanism was designed to keep us alive in a literally physically dangerous primitive world. We don't live in that world anymore and that primitive mechanism doesn't work well in today's world where most of us are lucky enough to live in safety and security. Those with adverse childhood experiences are more likely to live as terrified adults, and that's where you have to start your recovery.

@Diana-M is doing the work with impressive bravery, taking risks and being vulnerable. Go to her postings page and click on "all threads by..." at the bottom and start reading her earliest original threads. You can learn from her.

 

[Diana-M]

So I’ve been thinking about when my latest round of symptoms started brewing. It was about 5 years ago. It’s not so much that I’m “too nice” because I do too many nice things for people. It’s that I submit to circumstances I don’t want to be in. I say “yes,” when I really want to say “no.” But I’m too afraid of confrontation or of receiving some kind of embarrassment or shaming if I say no. Or worse, I’m conflicted: I feel a “good” person would say yes. Half the time, I don’t even know what I feel at the time things are happening. But that’s changing!

Examples:
My oldest son started being very rude, distant and cold. I kissed up to him when I wanted to just avoid him. I didn’t want him to withhold my grandkids from me.

My youngest son got married at the height of the pandemic. Everyone in our immediate family and the brides family went. I didn’t because I didn’t want exposure to Covid. But I was dreadfully sad and also angry they couldn’t wait til I could come. But instead I profusely apologized for not going.

My sister deliberately befriended my new daughter in law who hates me. Who does that? They get together and discuss me. But I act like nothing is wrong.

There’s more! But that gives you an idea. My body started saying, “hell no!” It just shut me down.

@JanAtheCPA, I had no idea this book is not universally loved. I sent this video to my husband this morning and he had the exact same reaction as @Blue_Man !

 

[Cactusflower]

“I’m too afraid of confrontation or of receiving some kind of embarrassment or shaming if I say no.”

Yes! I swear any time I’ve said no there is hell to pay. It is usually around holidays. No I spend my holidays without family (and now without psycho friends either!) and it’s kinda sad but at least it’s peaceful!

Choose your battles and pick your poison!

 

[BloodMoon]

courage in the face of what scares us is one of the 180-degree mindset flips that is essential for recovery.

If I could give this a million 'likes' I would!

and with this:

Those with adverse childhood experiences are more likely to live as terrified adults, and that's where you have to start your recovery.

 

[Ellen]

So I’ve been thinking about when my latest round of symptoms started brewing. It was about 5 years ago. It’s not so much that I’m “too nice” because I do too many nice things for people. It’s that I submit to circumstances I don’t want to be in. I say “yes,” when I really want to say “no.” But I’m too afraid of confrontation or of receiving some kind of embarrassment or shaming if I say no. Or worse, I’m conflicted: I feel a “good” person would say yes. Half the time, I don’t even know what I feel at the time things are happening. But that’s changing!

Examples:
My oldest son started being very rude, distant and cold. I kissed up to him when I wanted to just avoid him. I didn’t want him to withhold my grandkids from me.

My youngest son got married at the height of the pandemic. Everyone in our immediate family and the brides family went. I didn’t because I didn’t want exposure to Covid. But I was dreadfully sad and also angry they couldn’t wait til I could come. But instead I profusely apologized for not going.

My sister deliberately befriended my new daughter in law who hates me. Who does that? They get together and discuss me. But I act like nothing is wrong.

There’s more! But that gives you an idea. My body started saying, “hell no!” It just shut me down.

@JanAtheCPA, I had no idea this book is not universally loved. I sent this video to my husband this morning and he had the exact same reaction as @Blue_Man !

I've dealt with similar situations from a sister who was always in competition with me. I've fought back by refusing to give her any indication that it was bothering me. Actually praising her at times. It wasn't reflective of my true feelings, of course, but it took the wind out of her sails and she stopped doing those kinds of things as much. What I've learned in my TMS recovery is that it is only necessary for me to know the truth, and I don't have to let others know when they are upsetting me. Since upsetting me is their goal, I can reduce their behavior by not reinforcing it, while remaining true to myself. So I maintain these fraught family relationships at a very superficial level, just keeping the peace. I know it can be argued that I'm not living authentically, but peace is more important to me. Again, as long as I know and acknowledge the truth, my TMS is kept in check.

 

[BloodMoon]

I know it can be argued that I'm not living authentically, but peace is more important to me. Again, as long as I know and acknowledge the truth, my TMS is kept in check.

I agree -- it doesn't matter if you're not being authentic as long as you know the truth and also as long as you find that you can still recover from TMS or keep TMS free whilst knowing you're having to be inauthentic in order to get some peace.

praising her at times. It wasn't reflective of my true feelings, of course, but it took the wind out of her sails and she stopped doing those kinds of things as much.

That's good, though I surmise that your sister probably isn't a narcissist (or sociopath). I say this because my particular experience of having to deal with at least 3 narcissists in my life -- a long-term boyfriend that I had before I married my husband, a boss and a 'friend' and, as well as that, my husband having a narcissistic parent and a narcissistic brother -- is that they will always find ways of keep upping the anti.

As you probably know, narcs can resort to all manner of things to try to get their 'fix' of upsetting and trying to control you... to include smear campaigns, threats, stalking etc. I do though understand that there are different types of narcs, e.g. the grandiose, the covert, the malignant (at least 5 different types) so it might depend on what kind of narc you have in your life as to whether you can flatter them and/or 'grey stone' them successfully enough to get enough peace. Unfortunately, we couldn't do that with our particular narcs; we had to say 'no' by having nothing more to do with them.

 

[BloodMoon]

Half the time, I don’t even know what I feel at the time things are happening.

I'm not sure that it will necessarily work when trying to deal with a narc, but maybe it will with a narc's 'flying monkey' (the latter being an enabler of a narc)... I think what he's suggesting in this video is at least a good way of giving yourself some space and time to work out what you think when you're being asked by anyone to do something or something is happening that you're not sure what you feel about it:

Personally, I think that one of the comments below the video (on YouTube) suggesting that instead of saying "let me think about it and I'll get back to you", it's better to say "I'll think about it and I'll get back to you" is probably a good one.

 

[Diana-M]

Thanks to all of you for this great discussion! You can’t even imagine how much your advice and also your sympathy has helped me — and is still helping me!

@Ellen — I have always firmly believed that estrangement is more damaging than just somehow limping through a superficial relationship with family. Family is engraved on our hearts. To end a relationship with a close family member is like cutting out part of your heart. And instead of bringing peace, the sorrow and anger overwhelms on a daily basis. So it’s usually a no win to estrange someone.

BUT, what @BloodMoon said is true. Some people are so toxic, it’s actually the reverse. Knowing that they might interact with you at any time (and they WILL, because they do stalk) is extremely disturbing. It’s like drinking poison every day, whether you talk to them or not. You’re just waiting, like a victim, to receive another blow. And you don’t know how it will come or what the next sick twist will be from their psycho creative mind. You know those mean kids that would do things like pick the legs off a Daddy Long Legs spider (I hope you have these in England, BloodMoon, so you can get me reference.)? They pick the legs off and watch the poor spider writhe around with no legs. And usually they laugh. Well, I’m the Daddy Long Legs and my sister is the mean kid.

@Cactusflower — I love that you’ve given yourself permission to have holidays how you need them. And for me, this needs to extend, especially, to missing events with grandkids because I physically can’t make it. Or emotionally can’t. I was berating myself so much for this! It just seems horrible. But I realized my grandkids and I love each other. They will understand.

The truth is, I feel insanely HAPPY today with my decision to go no contact with my sister. And the guilt over whether she’s hurting or not over this is starting to fade. I’m singing that song from the Wizard of Oz, “Ding Dong the witch is dead.” I have been TORTURED by her. I’m not abandoning her for no reason. I’m abandoning her as a last resort to save my life. I feel so relieved. This issue has been so clouded for me because of my family programing that says I owe everybody at all cost. That I have to make us seem perfect, at all cost. Abuse goes on behind closed doors and we all smile. No one can know. I come from an extremely sick family. You name the abuse, it happened. My sisters and I got gorked (screwed up). End of story. It’s not my fault. Not a surprise it’s still a mess. But I can LIVE and soon I’ll be able to walk again. I just know it! I can honestly say I feel that much relief.

 

[Diana-M]

Those with adverse childhood experiences are more likely to live as terrified adults, and that's where you have to start your recovery.

@JanAtheCPA this is sooo true! Sad but true. Because current events trigger childhood hell. And your little children within just freak out. They don’t want any part of that ever again. My sister isn’t as bad as my Dad. But close. I never put all this together. I didn’t want to see it. This has taken 3 hard years of Internal Family System therapy, a year and a half of Al-Anon and 4 months in the wiki daily with hours a day journaling to figure this out. Wow! A lot of work!

 

[Diana-M]

I'm not sure that it will necessarily work when trying to deal with a narc, but maybe it will with a narc's 'flying monkey' (the latter being an enabler of a narc)... I think what he's suggesting in this video is at least a good way of giving yourself some space and time to work out what you think when you're being asked by anyone to do something or something is happening that you're not sure what you feel about it:

Personally, I think that one of the comments below the video (on YouTube) suggesting that instead of saying "let me think about it" it's better to say "I'll think about it" is good one.

I’m going to watch this over and over! LOVE it! Fantastic advice. I need this with the troublemakers I’m still keeping in my life. (Let me think about it, and I’ll get back to you. I’ve thought about it, and that just doesn’t work for me.) I’m not a victim child anymore I’m an adult!

 

[Ellen]

That's good, though I surmise that your sister probably isn't a narcissist (or sociopath).

This is true. She's just a jealous person with very low self esteem. I understand that narcissists and sociopaths have to be dealt with differently. But I find that using the "gray rock" technique does work well for lots of difficult people. But one's response always has to be calibrated to how toxic the interactions are.

 

[Diana-M]

t I find that using the "gray rock" technique does work well for lots of difficult people.

I agree! It works great!

 

[Diana-M]

Thanks to all of you for this great discussion! You can’t even imagine how much your advice and also your sympathy has helped me — and is still helping me!

@Ellen — I have always firmly believed that estrangement is more damaging than just somehow limping through a superficial relationship with family. Family is engraved on our hearts. To end a relationship with a close family member is like cutting out part of your heart. And instead of bringing peace, the sorrow and anger overwhelms on a daily basis. So it’s usually a no win to estrange someone.

BUT, what @BloodMoon said is true. Some people are so toxic, it’s actually the reverse. Knowing that they might interact with you at any time (and they WILL, because they’d do stalk) is extremely disturbing. It’s like drinking poison every day, whether you talk to them or not. You’re just waiting, like a victim, to receive another blow. And you don’t know how it will come or what the next sick twist will be from their psycho creative mind. You know those mean kids that would do things like pick the legs off a Daddy Long Legs spider (I hope you have these in England, BloodMoon, so you can get me reference.)? They pick the legs off and watch the poor spider writhe around with no legs. And usually they laugh. Well, I’m the Daddy Long Legs and my sister is the mean kid.

@Cactusflower — I love that you’ve given yourself permission to have holidays how you need them. And for me, this needs to extend, especially, to missing events with grandkids because I physically can’t make it. Or emotionally can’t. I was berating myself so much for this! It just seems horrible. But I realized my grandkids and I love each other. They will understand.

The truth is, I feel insanely HAPPY today with my decision to go no contact with my sister. And the guilt over whether she’s hurting or not over this is starting to fade. I’m singing that song from the Wizard of Oz, “Ding Dong the witch is dead.” I have been TORTURED by her. I’m not abandoning her for no reason. I’m abandoning her as a last resort to save my life. I feel so relieved. This issue has been so clouded for me because of my family programing that says I owe everybody at all cost. That I have to make us seem perfect, at all cost. Abuse goes on behind closed doors and we all smile. No one can know. I come from an extremely sick family. You name the abuse, it happened. My sisters and I got gorked (screwed up). End of story. It not my fault. Not a surprise it’s still a mess. But I can LIVE and soon I’ll be able to walk again. I just know it! I can honestly say I feel that much relief.

@JanAtheCPA did you see this? Thought you may have missed it.

 

[Cactusflower]

. I’m not abandoning her for no reason.

It's more like you are not abandoning yourself.

 

[BloodMoon]

Daddy Long Legs spider (I hope you have these in England, BloodMoon, so you can get me reference.)?

Thanks, yep, we do, and I do!

And the guilt over whether she’s hurting or not over this is starting to fade.

Good! I'm glad to hear that it's fading. As you say, you're the Daddy Long Legs and your sister's been pulling your legs off and watching you writhe around for years. Her feelings will only be hurt by the fact that you won't allow her to pull your legs off any more and you're taking away her supply of sadistic entertainment; there is therefore absolutely nothing to feel guilty about. (I know you know all this, but I think it can help if someone else says this to you when you've been an unwitting victim of a narcissist.)

Also, up until fairly recently you hadn't realised what your sister is so - although I'm no psychotherapist - I think that the guilt that you're still feeling is for cutting off the sister that you wanted to have (and she pretended to be) rather than the sister that you actually have -- From my own experience of being involved with a narcissist (my long-term boyfriend) who I wanted to be one thing (and he pretended to be as I wanted) but he was actually something else, intellectually I got it, but it was hard and it took a while for it to really sink into the depths of my brain. When it does sink in however, feelings like guilt go away.

 

[Diana-M]

you're taking away her supply of sadistic entertainment; there is therefore absolutely nothing to feel guilty about.

It's more like you are not abandoning yourself.

I think that the guilt that you're still feeling is for cutting off the sister that you wanted to have

Oh my goodness! I love love what you guys are saying! And it DOES help to hear you say it!!! And even writing the things I’ve said—for all to see!— is healing!