I really hope that I'm not annoying all of you people to death, I'm having such a hard time on the TMS journey, though I have made some significant progress. I have come to the realization that my TMS issues are ultimately rooted in my not believing that I can really make it in life. I have issues of confidence in my competence regarding daily life, etc. I am trying to process trauma of my life and move forward. I am trying not to live in fear.
having said this, I am very weak. My particular brand of TMS is MECFS. I am not strong enough to do many day-to-day tasks, and need help. To this end, I've been trying to build my strength. Relative to where I was at my worst, I am quite a bit stronger. however, I still have a long ways to go. In some ways, my strength is nearly normal, in other ways it is profoundly lacking. For instance, it is very difficult for me to bend over and pick something off the ground. I just don't have the postural strength for it, and will be worn out for a long time and doing so.
I will enter into a cycle in which I will start to put on strength for several months, and then one of two things will happen. Either my body will start to spontaneously shut down during a period of stress, in which case I lose months worth of progress, or I suffer some sort of injury, and have to back off. These injuries are not that frequent, but the frequent enough to prevent any sort of real goals from being met.
for instance, the musculature throughout my entire body is very tight. In order to walk at all, first thing in the morning I need to stretch my legs. It takes about half an hour for them to loosen to the point where I can walk. Given this level of tightness throughout my body, I tried doing a bench press of 60 pounds back in December. I had been working up to this by doing push-ups off of elevated surfaces. I had the strength to do this, but my chest muscles were profoundly tight. I "hurt" my rotator cuff. Whether it was TMS or an actual injury, I can't say. I spoke with two TMS practitioners, who thought that it very well could've been an actual injury, given the mechanics. One of these practitioners is a name that most here would recognize. So, this meant that I had to take it easy with upper body exercises for two or three months. Then, when I started feeling reasonably good, I gradually worked my way up to where I am now. I have finally surpassed the level of strength I was at back in December, by a good margin.
I have been using a seated press machine, which is a lot easier on my chest, as I can control how close the bar comes to my chest. During the period of shoulder injury, I was perhaps doing 30 pounds, high reps. as of about two months ago, I started pressing 80 pounds, and this was done intermittently. It would only be done every two weeks or so, with other exercises in the interm. Two weeks ago, I pressed 100 pounds. it was very difficult to do. It took all I had in me to get 10 reps out.
Thinking that I might have actually put on a little bit of strength in two weeks, and wanting the psychological satisfaction of pressing 105 pounds (as this is the equivalent to doing a bench press with a standard 45 pound bar, and a 25 pound plate on either side, the amount that I was able to do as a freshman in high school) I decided to press 105 pounds today. This was after having done some VERY heavy lat pull downs and rows, with about a five minute break prior to starting the press. I was able to muster eight reps. Perhaps I could've gotten a partial ninth, but I decided to play it safe, and not proceed further. Immediately, when I stopped, I felt a pain around my right elbow, it feels like more so the tendons than the ligaments, though it could be both. It was very mild, maybe only being a level one, and I decided not to do any more upper body exercises for the day. In short order, the pain became more pronounced. Now, about seven hours later, it's probably at around the level 3/10.
in retrospect, I wish that I had followed the advice that I gave myself in the past, which was to make sure that I could do a particular exercise to 15 repetitions prior to increasing weight. I did not think there would be a problem with the press, because my shoulder was not bothering me when I did the 10 reps at 100 pounds two weeks ago. It never occurred to me that some other part of my body simply might not be up to the task.
I was working with a trainer, and I asked her about the pain for reassurance. I asked her if it was possible that I could've injured myself, or if this was likely just my nervous system playing tricks with me. She's familiar with the TMS concept, because I worked with her before, and I've tried explaining it to her. She said that there was in fact a good chance that I could've hurt my arm, as she has hurt herself in similar ways before. She said that in a couple days, it should be back to the point where I can continue lifting as I was, though it will probably still hurt. I asked her if perhaps the issue was that my ligaments and tendons were simply not up to the task, since I might've progressed too quickly from 80 pounds to 105. She didn't seem to think so.
First off, for you guys who weight lift, what do you make of this? Do you think this is an injury AT ALL? If it is, do you think I should just start pushing fullbore ahead in two or three days? Thirdly, I feel that the more I baby these things, the more I might be helping in the short term, but the more I contribute to TMS never ending. Years ago, I visited Dr. Rashbaum, Sarno's former partner, and he said to me, that in his opinion, I definitely have TMS, but he cannot speak to whether any individual ache or pain is TMS or a real injury. So, I'd be grateful for some input on all of this.
This is reminiscent of what happened last spring. Since the fall of 2023 until the spring of 2024, I had been increasing my upper body strength. I then hurt the same area of my right elbow, and ended up losing months worth of progress. I just really don't want this to happen again. Likewise, I don't want to lose progress the way I lost progress for months after I "hurt" my shoulder back in December.
I suppose the fact of the matter is, if I was too ambitious, and too impatient, and actually hurt myself, maybe it's inevitable that I just have to deal with the consequence of losing a lot of upper body strength. This seems like a horrible thing, though, and I would not want this to happen at all.
Again, I apologize for posting redundantly, with various issues that seem to vary in mechanism of injury and so forth, but I'm just having trouble. If anybody can be of help, I really appreciate it. Thanks
p.s.- I found the following. There was a thread that dealt with a gym injury, though the circumstances were rather different than those that I described.The first is from TMS help, posted by "westcoastram". This first post seems to indicate that things like this are probably TMS. The second post, indicates that maybe I should take it easy, and maybe it's a real injury. I certainly can't tell you what to do here but I can relate my own experiences.
When I got back into weight-lifting after sarno... I would get what I would have classified previously as sprains and strains all over my body while working out.
What I did was focus on the "injury" and think psychological about it and then the next time I went to the gym and felt the pain - right there, right then - I would think of something that I knew (back when I was deep in sarno pain) that was bothering me and one of three things would happen.
1) The pain wouldn't get any worse and I'd just go about my workout and then it would go away afterwards.
2) The pain would move to a new location or a new "injury" in the workout. i.e., I'd have calf pain and I'd do squats and the pain would move to my butt.
3) The pain would just disappear.
In fact, I still get little aches and pains while working out but I know what they are now... for me, they are my TMS conditioning acting up.
P. S. Pay attention to what you're working out too! Sometimes I'll get the old Sarno pain when I bench press but if I do incline or decline (exercises that agruably work the same muscles just differently) I don't feel a thing... one of the best indicators of TMS I've ever had.
I certainly can't tell you what to do here but I can relate my own experiences.
When I got back into weight-lifting after sarno... I would get what I would have classified previously as sprains and strains all over my body while working out.
What I did was focus on the "injury" and think psychological about it and then the next time I went to the gym and felt the pain - right there, right then - I would think of something that I knew (back when I was deep in sarno pain) that was bothering me and one of three things would happen.
1) The pain wouldn't get any worse and I'd just go about my workout and then it would go away afterwards.
2) The pain would move to a new location or a new "injury" in the workout. i.e., I'd have calf pain and I'd do squats and the pain would move to my butt.
3) The pain would just disappear.
In fact, I still get little aches and pains while working out but I know what they are now... for me, they are my TMS conditioning acting up.
P. S. Pay attention to what you're working out too! Sometimes I'll get the old Sarno pain when I bench press but if I do incline or decline (exercises that agruably work the same muscles just differently) I don't feel a thing... one of the best indicators of TMS I've ever had.
This is the second post, from this forum, by Bigbluewolf:
I have been involved in weight training most of my adult life (over 50 now). Injury comes with the territory. You take it easy on that body part until you can use it effectively again. But in hindsight I now know that some injuries where pain doing "that movement" persisted for years had to be TMS. There's just no other explanation and "tendonitis" as you said is not a permanent condition.
Even so, a month can be pretty fast to heal from an injury involving tissues like tendons. Go easy on yourself. Maybe dedicate a month to legs and core exercises. For upper body find machines that allow you to grip without putting your wrist in a position that aggravates it. Give it room and don't rush. Isn't that always what we weight trainers want to do? Rush getting over an injury?
After that month, start working to introduce range of motion movement back. By degrees it should get better and not bother you any more. If it's not making any progress as you rehab it or gets worse, I'd strongly suspect TMS at that point.
having said this, I am very weak. My particular brand of TMS is MECFS. I am not strong enough to do many day-to-day tasks, and need help. To this end, I've been trying to build my strength. Relative to where I was at my worst, I am quite a bit stronger. however, I still have a long ways to go. In some ways, my strength is nearly normal, in other ways it is profoundly lacking. For instance, it is very difficult for me to bend over and pick something off the ground. I just don't have the postural strength for it, and will be worn out for a long time and doing so.
I will enter into a cycle in which I will start to put on strength for several months, and then one of two things will happen. Either my body will start to spontaneously shut down during a period of stress, in which case I lose months worth of progress, or I suffer some sort of injury, and have to back off. These injuries are not that frequent, but the frequent enough to prevent any sort of real goals from being met.
for instance, the musculature throughout my entire body is very tight. In order to walk at all, first thing in the morning I need to stretch my legs. It takes about half an hour for them to loosen to the point where I can walk. Given this level of tightness throughout my body, I tried doing a bench press of 60 pounds back in December. I had been working up to this by doing push-ups off of elevated surfaces. I had the strength to do this, but my chest muscles were profoundly tight. I "hurt" my rotator cuff. Whether it was TMS or an actual injury, I can't say. I spoke with two TMS practitioners, who thought that it very well could've been an actual injury, given the mechanics. One of these practitioners is a name that most here would recognize. So, this meant that I had to take it easy with upper body exercises for two or three months. Then, when I started feeling reasonably good, I gradually worked my way up to where I am now. I have finally surpassed the level of strength I was at back in December, by a good margin.
I have been using a seated press machine, which is a lot easier on my chest, as I can control how close the bar comes to my chest. During the period of shoulder injury, I was perhaps doing 30 pounds, high reps. as of about two months ago, I started pressing 80 pounds, and this was done intermittently. It would only be done every two weeks or so, with other exercises in the interm. Two weeks ago, I pressed 100 pounds. it was very difficult to do. It took all I had in me to get 10 reps out.
Thinking that I might have actually put on a little bit of strength in two weeks, and wanting the psychological satisfaction of pressing 105 pounds (as this is the equivalent to doing a bench press with a standard 45 pound bar, and a 25 pound plate on either side, the amount that I was able to do as a freshman in high school) I decided to press 105 pounds today. This was after having done some VERY heavy lat pull downs and rows, with about a five minute break prior to starting the press. I was able to muster eight reps. Perhaps I could've gotten a partial ninth, but I decided to play it safe, and not proceed further. Immediately, when I stopped, I felt a pain around my right elbow, it feels like more so the tendons than the ligaments, though it could be both. It was very mild, maybe only being a level one, and I decided not to do any more upper body exercises for the day. In short order, the pain became more pronounced. Now, about seven hours later, it's probably at around the level 3/10.
in retrospect, I wish that I had followed the advice that I gave myself in the past, which was to make sure that I could do a particular exercise to 15 repetitions prior to increasing weight. I did not think there would be a problem with the press, because my shoulder was not bothering me when I did the 10 reps at 100 pounds two weeks ago. It never occurred to me that some other part of my body simply might not be up to the task.
I was working with a trainer, and I asked her about the pain for reassurance. I asked her if it was possible that I could've injured myself, or if this was likely just my nervous system playing tricks with me. She's familiar with the TMS concept, because I worked with her before, and I've tried explaining it to her. She said that there was in fact a good chance that I could've hurt my arm, as she has hurt herself in similar ways before. She said that in a couple days, it should be back to the point where I can continue lifting as I was, though it will probably still hurt. I asked her if perhaps the issue was that my ligaments and tendons were simply not up to the task, since I might've progressed too quickly from 80 pounds to 105. She didn't seem to think so.
First off, for you guys who weight lift, what do you make of this? Do you think this is an injury AT ALL? If it is, do you think I should just start pushing fullbore ahead in two or three days? Thirdly, I feel that the more I baby these things, the more I might be helping in the short term, but the more I contribute to TMS never ending. Years ago, I visited Dr. Rashbaum, Sarno's former partner, and he said to me, that in his opinion, I definitely have TMS, but he cannot speak to whether any individual ache or pain is TMS or a real injury. So, I'd be grateful for some input on all of this.
This is reminiscent of what happened last spring. Since the fall of 2023 until the spring of 2024, I had been increasing my upper body strength. I then hurt the same area of my right elbow, and ended up losing months worth of progress. I just really don't want this to happen again. Likewise, I don't want to lose progress the way I lost progress for months after I "hurt" my shoulder back in December.
I suppose the fact of the matter is, if I was too ambitious, and too impatient, and actually hurt myself, maybe it's inevitable that I just have to deal with the consequence of losing a lot of upper body strength. This seems like a horrible thing, though, and I would not want this to happen at all.
Again, I apologize for posting redundantly, with various issues that seem to vary in mechanism of injury and so forth, but I'm just having trouble. If anybody can be of help, I really appreciate it. Thanks
p.s.- I found the following. There was a thread that dealt with a gym injury, though the circumstances were rather different than those that I described.The first is from TMS help, posted by "westcoastram". This first post seems to indicate that things like this are probably TMS. The second post, indicates that maybe I should take it easy, and maybe it's a real injury. I certainly can't tell you what to do here but I can relate my own experiences.
When I got back into weight-lifting after sarno... I would get what I would have classified previously as sprains and strains all over my body while working out.
What I did was focus on the "injury" and think psychological about it and then the next time I went to the gym and felt the pain - right there, right then - I would think of something that I knew (back when I was deep in sarno pain) that was bothering me and one of three things would happen.
1) The pain wouldn't get any worse and I'd just go about my workout and then it would go away afterwards.
2) The pain would move to a new location or a new "injury" in the workout. i.e., I'd have calf pain and I'd do squats and the pain would move to my butt.
3) The pain would just disappear.
In fact, I still get little aches and pains while working out but I know what they are now... for me, they are my TMS conditioning acting up.
P. S. Pay attention to what you're working out too! Sometimes I'll get the old Sarno pain when I bench press but if I do incline or decline (exercises that agruably work the same muscles just differently) I don't feel a thing... one of the best indicators of TMS I've ever had.
I certainly can't tell you what to do here but I can relate my own experiences.
When I got back into weight-lifting after sarno... I would get what I would have classified previously as sprains and strains all over my body while working out.
What I did was focus on the "injury" and think psychological about it and then the next time I went to the gym and felt the pain - right there, right then - I would think of something that I knew (back when I was deep in sarno pain) that was bothering me and one of three things would happen.
1) The pain wouldn't get any worse and I'd just go about my workout and then it would go away afterwards.
2) The pain would move to a new location or a new "injury" in the workout. i.e., I'd have calf pain and I'd do squats and the pain would move to my butt.
3) The pain would just disappear.
In fact, I still get little aches and pains while working out but I know what they are now... for me, they are my TMS conditioning acting up.
P. S. Pay attention to what you're working out too! Sometimes I'll get the old Sarno pain when I bench press but if I do incline or decline (exercises that agruably work the same muscles just differently) I don't feel a thing... one of the best indicators of TMS I've ever had.
This is the second post, from this forum, by Bigbluewolf:
I have been involved in weight training most of my adult life (over 50 now). Injury comes with the territory. You take it easy on that body part until you can use it effectively again. But in hindsight I now know that some injuries where pain doing "that movement" persisted for years had to be TMS. There's just no other explanation and "tendonitis" as you said is not a permanent condition.
Even so, a month can be pretty fast to heal from an injury involving tissues like tendons. Go easy on yourself. Maybe dedicate a month to legs and core exercises. For upper body find machines that allow you to grip without putting your wrist in a position that aggravates it. Give it room and don't rush. Isn't that always what we weight trainers want to do? Rush getting over an injury?
After that month, start working to introduce range of motion movement back. By degrees it should get better and not bother you any more. If it's not making any progress as you rehab it or gets worse, I'd strongly suspect TMS at that point.
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