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Day 10 Questions and status update

Discussion in 'Structured Educational Program' started by JulieB, May 26, 2014.

  1. JulieB

    JulieB New Member

    I think I am progressing on this treatment for TMS. My low back pain has greatly decreased and often I have no pain, however, now I have pain all over the greater trochanter and hips along with intermittant "burning" on my thighs, neck, face and upper back. I did a short adrenal yoga session and shoulders are pretty sore and now I have "burning" there as well. I am usually "all in" on the TMS diagnosis, because it just makes sense to me, but I sometimes wish there were a TMS doctor here in Denver to validate the diagnosis.

    I have found my mind to be my worst enemy and have noticed how much fear there is in my thoughts. I find affirmations helpful, have been doing deep breathing and meditation and am often pain free when I am engrossed in something.

    My struggle really is trying to understand whether the adrenal fatigue I have is a part of TMS or is another thing going on as well as TMS. Maybe everyone feels this way, but I feel my case is complicated. There is just so much going on in the way of how many body systems seem to be involved in my case. There have been so many times over the last few years when I have gone back to working out and have "crashed" and insomnia, fatigue, depression, acne, menstrual irregularities and body pain has come back, so I have a lot of trepidation around working out. Is there anyone who can relate and can offer some advice/encouragement?

    Thank you for this form and all of you who help out in reaching out to us. Blessings!

    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.
  2. Ellen

    Ellen Beloved Grand Eagle


    I've had all the symptoms you list (except acne), and many more over the span of most of life that involved many different body systems. I am convinced that it is all TMS. I've been working at this for over a year and have gotten rid of the pain symptoms. But I still have insomnia, depression, and fatigue. I believe the fatigue is secondary to the insomnia, depression, and decades of chronic tension. Someone on this Forum once wrote that repressing emotions takes a lot of energy and can leave us exhausted.

    I understand your doubts, but there is no downside to focusing on TMS healing strategies, is there? At the time when I thought I had adrenal fatigue (before learning about TMS), there really weren't any viable treatments for it other than some nutritional supplements. I had a bad experience with steroids, so that was off the table. Is there some treatment for it that you are planning to pursue that you feel conflicts with TMS healing strategies? I never had a TMS doctor validate my diagnosis, but had many medical tests that ruled out everything else, so I felt fine going forward with TMS.

    I would suggest taking it very slowly with working out for the time being. Just start small and add time and intensity in small increments to avoid crashing. Build on your success. Be patient. It takes time for many of us to heal. Are you using an evidence sheet and the concept of outcome independence? (check out Alan Gordon's Recovery Program)

    Best wishes
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  3. JulieB

    JulieB New Member


    Thank you so much for your encouragement. I greatly appreciate it! There are no other adrenal treatment options that I am aware of, and as stress is very much the cause of that, I believe I am on the right track. I read through Alan Gordon's Recovery Program but will check out the evidence sheet and the concept of outcome independence. Thank you again and blessings to you!
    Eric "Herbie" Watson and Ellen like this.
  4. Ryan

    Ryan Well known member

    You will heal, just have perseverance and faith. It's sounds like you are still doubting the tms diagnosis fully. You need to be at a place where you can without doubt know its tms, a lot easier said then done. It took me a while to fully accept tms and I have not been diagnosed either. You are on the right path just try not to fear tms symptoms, especially when they move. It's easy to stop the pain but the symptom shift is hard and takes time. Just be patient and not so hard on yourself. But you have come a long way so far, be greatful. Don't know if your a spiritual person but to know god is there to help you and he can give you acceptance is powerful. I believe my tms has happend for a reason and god was trying to bring me to become a better person. I'm not fully healed but close to it and when you get there you will experience spiritual changing that is unexplainably powerful. Just take your time and live in the moment each day, don't look forward or back. You will get there, just know pain and suffering only make you a better person. Without pain and suffering you would not grow. Try reading "Great Pain Deception" by Steve Ozanich, it's a wonderful book and helped me a lot. You have what it takes to heal Inside of you just give it time and you will heal, best of luck.

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  5. Eric "Herbie" Watson

    Eric "Herbie" Watson Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hello JulieB, You have had some great advice by many friends above, god bless you all... Awesome.
    I will give some advice now, see above the progress you have made -- give that your attention and how you arrived there.
    It's when we worry about our symptoms that feed them.
    You have power over your thoughts and you can get your attention back to the progress and away from the issues. It does take daily practice but it also gets easier, small steps make huge leaps.
    The focus we give to anything helps it grow ( Whether that be the good or bad ) focus on parts of the body that don't hurt and you will eventually come to grips with this seemingly out of control thought process.
    Why does it seem out of control? Cause it's habit to you now or unconscious, it's time to make a new habit of controlling those thought patterns then you will create new neural pathways and the old ones that created this trail to your pain will become weak and of no use anymore.:)
    Honestly, This morning I felt tired and then I came back to the now and focused on what I was doing in the now and the weakness left suddenly, fast. Then I felt anxious momentarily and again I focused in the now and again the anxious feeling left, suddenly.

    When you feel anxious cause of anxious thoughts know that if you stop and take some deep breathes and focus on only your breathing -- then you will calm down. Then say my mind is my best friend, I have control and focus on nothing but in the now, then feel the emotions you have attached to this issue and breath deep again saying I release and let this go. I am strong, I am strong.....
    Fear thoughts often come in feelings, sensations, pictures and sounds in our minds -- they can be of future thoughts or trivialities. We just never been taught that we can control these emotions after we accept them. Like if its sensations then let them be and feel them with no judgement or criticism toward them -- then you will feel them start to dissipate. If it's sounds or pictures let me know and I will tell you what to do with them. Our unconscious mind stores every memory we have ever known, the good and the bad. The problem, we focus more on the bad ones than the good ones. Think on the good ones like the progress you have made so far and the times you have had the best times of your life. Positive thinking alone will not get rid of these issues, its when we face these issues, feel them for what they are without fearing them and saying over and over I'm strong and I feel terrific, I feel terrific -- then in about 5 minute you will start to feel what you are saying. :)

    See here you call this issue a struggle, do like Walt says and start saying this is a piece of cake..... You have the answers, continue your journey and keep reconditioning my friend and soon you too will be writing your success story.

    Remember we have many, many sensations and emotions that we feel in our bodies, when we think this emotion or sensation is the one that will give me adrenal fatigue then that is exactly what will happen. The next time you feel these emotions or sensations think of them as positive energy of calmness or power and see what happens.:)
    Bless you and Peace.
    JulieB likes this.
  6. JulieB

    JulieB New Member

    Ryan and Eric,

    Thank you both so much for taking time to respond to my post. I don't even know if you will see this response, but I wanted to comment on your comments. It is amazing the power of these encouragements to me from those of you who have conquered this. Ryan, you mentioned God, and Eric, I know you are a christian (pastor too, maybe?), so did you ever wrestle with God over all of this? I am a strong, committed christian and feel like I am in a valley with our Lord. I know He hasn't moved, but I have. I sense I have some anger toward Him for not just healing me of this. Selfish, I know. I have seen His hand along this long journey, but have always struggled with my faith vs. my responsibility vs. God's sovereignty. Clearly, if God healed me, I would still have these thought patterns that got me here in the first place, so I feel that God has been telling me to "trust the process", to keep my eyes on Him and that He is with me always. Anyway, just wondered if either of you ever felt frustrated with God over your TMS?

    I will continue to read and re-read your comments to continue the affirmation process. Thank you again and God bless!
    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.
  7. Ryan

    Ryan Well known member


    I used to question why would god put me through this or many other trials in life. I believe he did this for a reason, for you to trust in him and grow as a person. Like I said before, pain and suffering is what causes people to change. I used to think I could always fix things myself and I didn't need spirituality, boy was I wrong! Look at this from a positive growth view. I believe everything happens for a reason in life and we are at a place that we are supposed to be. It's ok to be angry towards god, at least you recognized you were angry! Don't be hard on yourself or have shame for this, we are all human and no one is perfect. God will always be there for you and forgive you no matter what, that's why he did on the cross for us. I am thankful that I had this pain and suffering from tms because it made me change as a person and to strengthen my relationship with god. We are all put here to love one another and learn to forgive, even forgive yourself. Just know thet everything will be ok and keep changing your thought patterns and you will see results. Nothing will come easy but that's what makes it great when you heal. Perseverance and faith will get you a long way! Just look at how far you have come already and try not to put expectations on yourself for where you should be. The bad times will pass and you will have more and more good days to come. By the way you live in my favorite state!

    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.
  8. JulieB

    JulieB New Member

  9. JulieB

    JulieB New Member


    I know you are right and really want to be thankful for this, but I am not there yet. I am coming to accept it, but thankful, nope, not yet. I am trying not to feel guilty about that and know that I will get to a place of gratitude for this seemingly long trial. I am SO thankful that God is patient, slow to anger and abounding in love! I just had to ask other believers if they, too, struggled with God in their acceptance of TMS. It has been an eye-opening journey thus far in realizing how my thought pattern has become so negative and defeating and that I can overcome this, with time, perseverance, patience and loving acceptance of myself and my journey. Thank you so much for taking time out of your day to help others. Your response above brought tears to my eyes. God is good and He shows me everyday through other people. Today, He used you, so thank you!

    We moved out here 8 years ago from the midwest and we LOVE it out here in Colorado! We have never regretted a day out here and can't imagine living anywhere else, with the exception of the Pacific Northwest. One never tires of looking at or being in the mountains. I assume from your comment you don't live in Colorado, but have visited it?
    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.
  10. Ryan

    Ryan Well known member

    Thank you for the kind words, we are all here to help and love one another. I used to go backpacking, tent camping, and fly fish every summer when I was younger. It is so nice out there, I have been all over the state, but I love Silverton, Durango, telluride area. It's so peaceful and air feels so clean over there. I live in hot and humid louisiana, we do have good food though! I would love to live there one day!

    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.
  11. Eric "Herbie" Watson

    Eric "Herbie" Watson Beloved Grand Eagle

    Awesome, love it -- Thank You JulieB. I was a preacher for almost 6 years, even though I am not a pastor - See in the bible belt, you preach from church to church if you wish -- A pastor basically stays at 1 church and watches over the sheep there. Either one is great, I will preach at the drop of a hat and I love my lord Jesus Christ with all of my heart but yes I have gotten angry because I thought I can heal heal all of these great loving folks but I can't heal myself, hum... So it was a combination of anger toward God and myself.
    I knew in my spirit that God had a way out for me if I just kept looking and that I did, as soon as I found out about Dr, . Sarnos theory then that confirmed it, I saw all the puzzle come together and soon ( 6 months) I was on my way up and shouting halleluah from the roof tops. I give God all the credit but I know he has put great minds here to help us. ( If all the books we're written that contained Jesus teachings then the whole world would not be able to hold them all.
    Keep your faith strong in God, he sent you to the right place. I am going to give you some advice that helped me with my journey along with Sarnos Theory ok, bless you

    Here is just some of Claire's Wisdom -- these are some of her most famous tools

    Dos and Don’ts
    1. Do not run away from fear. Analyze it and see it as no more then physical feelings. Feelings are not facts, do not be bluffed.
    2. Accept all strange sensations connected with your illness. Do not
    fight them. Float past them. Recognize that they are temporary.
    3. Let there be no self-pity.
    4. Settle your problems as quickly as you can, if not with action, then by glimpsing and accepting a new point of view.
    5. Waste no time on “What might have been” and “If only…”
    6. Face sorrow and know that time will bring relief.
    7. Be occupied. Do not lie in bed brooding. Be occupied calmly , not feverishly trying to forget yourself.
    8. Remember that the strength in a muscle may depend on the confidence with which it is used.
    9. Accept your obsessions and be prepared to live with them
    temporarily. Do not fight them by trying to push them away. Let time do
    10. Remember your recovery does not necessarily depend “entirely on
    you” as so many people are so ready to tell you. You may need help.
    Accept it willingly, without shame.
    11. Do not measure your progress day by day. Don’t count the months,
    years you have been ill and despair at the thought of them. Once you
    are on the right road to recovery, recovery is inevitable, however
    protracted your illness may have been.
    12. Remember withdrawal is your jailer. Recovery lies on the other side of panic. Recovery lies in places you fear.
    13. Do not be discouraged if you cannot make decisions while you are ill. When you are well, decisions will be more easily made.
    14. Never accept total defeat. It is never too late to give yourself another chance.
    15. Practice don’t test.
    16. Face. Accept. Float. Let time pass.
    If you do this, you WILL recover.

    I want to say what facing is where you know your about to have anxiety or a pain episode right. So you don't fear it, or judge it or criticize it. Wait for it to come if it must, most everyone has been taught to hate anxiety and Pain. Well the more you hate it the more it will become and the bigger it will get so you have to learn how to Float. I'd highly recommend getting her book ok.

    This is a list of Dr. Abraham Lowes most famous Tools.

    Tools List
    The tools on this list are quoted or adapted from Mental Health Through Will Training (MH), Selections from Dr. Low’s Works (SEL) and Manage Your Fears, Manage Your Anger (MYF) and will help you take part in a Recovery International meeting. Many other tools can be found in these books.
    Some Basic RI Tools
    Treat mental health as a business and not as a game………………..…...……………MH ch.25
    Humor is our best friend, temper is our worst enemy……………………………….…..MH p.108
    If you can't change a situation you can change your attitude towards it...MYF p.108, Sel. p.31‐32
    Be self‐led, not symptom‐led. …..………………………………………......MYF p.114‐118, 280‐283
    Nervous symptoms and sensations are distressing but not dangerous…….….….. SEL p.53, MH p.115, 119
    Temper is, among other things, an intellectual blindness to the other side of the story…………MH p.159
    Comfort is a want, not a need. ………………………………..……………......….....MH chs.13, 22
    There is no right or wrong in the trivialities of every day life………...SEL p.39, MH p.157, 195‐196
    Calm begets calm, temper begets temper………………………….…...…….MYF p.245, SEL p.31
    Don't take our own dear selves too seriously………………………………....………….MH p.109
    Feelings should be expressed and temper suppressed…………………....……...…....MH p.178
    Helplessness is not hopelessness………………………..……………….……MH ch.7, MYF p.184
    Some people have a passion for self‐distrust…….…………...…..…….MH ch.29 & MYF Lecture 2
    Temper maintains and intensifies symptoms………………………..…….……….……MH p. 219
    Do things in part acts……………………………………………….…….……….……MH p.246‐249
    Endorse yourself for the effort, not only for the performance……...…….MYF p.13, SEL p.46, 132
    Have the courage to make a mistake………………..……….MH p.203, ch.30, MYF p.60, SEL p.108
    Feelings are not facts……………………………...……………..………….MH ch.9, MYF Lecture 14
    Do the things you fear and hate to do……………...………..…………...MH p. 329‐330, MYF p.197
    Fear is a belief –– beliefs can be changed………………………………………….MYF p.266‐269
    Every act of self‐control leads to a sense of self‐respect....…………….…….………..MH p.166
    Decide, plan and act. ………………………….……………………………………………...MH p.42
    Any decision will steady you……………………………………...……………….………...MYF p.5
    Anticipation is often worse than realization….…………………..…..………….MH p.114‐115, 146
    Replace an insecure thought with a secure thought……………..……….….……..MYF Lecture 1
    Bear the discomfort in order to gain comfort…………………….………….…………….MH p.149
    Hurt feelings are just beliefs not shared………………………………….………………..SEL p.21
    Self‐appointed expectations lead to self‐induced frustrations…………….…………….SEL p.35
    People do things that annoy us, not necessarily to annoy us………..…...…………….MH ch.48
    Knowledge teaches you what to do, practice tells you how to do it……...……………SEL p.118
    Muscles can be commanded to do what one fears to do………………………..……..SEL p.123
    Tempers are frequently uncontrolled, but not uncontrollable.…………………………..MH p.392

    And if you have any anxiety then don't forget these powerful audios ok,

    These audio recordings of Claire Weekes have gotten me through a lot

    Part 1


    Part 2


    Part 3


    Part 4


    I also wrote a book with Walt Oleksy that gives my whole story and my battle with the thoughts you mention. "God Does not Want you to be in pain". You can find lots of excerpts that are beneficial from all of the new summaries from our Tuesday night shows.

    This Tuesday (May 13th) the call-in discussion group will be discussing “Eric's Journey – Chapter 5” and “Walt's Journey – Chapter 5 ” in God Does Not Want You to Be in Pain by forum members Eric "Herbie" Watson and Walt Oleksy. The recorded discussion will start at 9:00pm Eastern Time. Phone lines will open about half an hour early for folks to talk beforehand, off the recording. Connection details are as follows (for more detailed instructions, visit www.tmswiki.org/ppd/connect ):

    • If you're connecting by phone, dial 1 201-479-4595 and when prompted enter the pin code 18311499 followed by the pound symbol.

    • If you're connecting via your computer (Fuze Meeting), go to http://fuze.me/18311499 and follow the instructions from there.

    For more information about the discussion group, and to listen to all past recorded discussions, visit www.tmswiki.org/ppd/Call-In_Peer_Discussion_Group.

    God Does Not Want You to be in Pain: Proven Techniques and Faith Can Heal You (2014)

    Eric’s Journey - Chapter 5: “The Glow of the Faithful” and “The Visit” – About Perceptions, Knowledge Therapy, How to Know It’s TMS, pp. 118-130

    Walt’s Journey - Chapter 5: Journaling 3: “Of Love and Sauerkraut”, pp. 131-142

    Eric’s Journey - Chapter 5: “The Glow of the Faithful” and “The Visit” – About Perceptions, Knowledge Therapy, How to Know It’s TMS, pp. 118-130.

    In this chapter, Eric chronicles his transformation from alcoholic to Sunday school teacher to reborn Christian healer while demonstrating, in the process, a direct connection between Dr Sarno’s injunction that you must believe 100% that “there is nothing physically wrong or broken in your body” and the principles underlying Christian religious belief. Eric notes that despite being “lost” in the wilderness while using wine as a way to dull his TMS pain, finally through “prayer and faith and acceptance of pain” his “new-found knowledge” made him stronger and helped him to find his spiritual avocation at last.

    14 thoughts to ponder and how to know it’s TMS

    Eric ends this chapter with a list of thoughts to ponder and a very useful check sheet for determining whether your pain is structural or due to TMS. He admits that this is very hard to do if you’ve been told by MDs and PTs based on an MRI that a structural problem such as a bulging disk or something abnormal in you leg, neck, or shoulder is causing your pain.

    1. Can you remember when you took some “me time” to go out and appreciate your life?

    2. Have you taken time in the last month to relax and meditate on purpose?

    3. Always strive to draw connections between your pain and certain situational and emotional patterns, asking whether you were under unusual stress of any kind at the onset of your pain symptoms? Does it only occur when your driving, or when you’re angry or upset?

    4. Be especially aware that, very often, thought precedes the pain, instead of the other way around. Does the pain develop in the morning after being absent all night? As Eric notes, you’ll find that you’ll be thinking about your back only a moment before the pain starts there.

    5. If your pain went away previously using TMS self-treatment therapy “you can be close to positive it’s TMS again”. As Eric emphasizes, you have to “remember TMS is there to trick you and make you think each new pain is something physical.”

    6. Does the quality of the pain (sharp, dull, ongoing, intermittent etc) match up with certain preconceived ideas you might have about how a particular symptoms might feel? If you recognize the connection, it probably is conditioned pain thinks Eric.

    7. Does the pain have tendency to go away when you’re busy or preoccupied with something else? That is, does the pain disappear when you stop focusing on it?

    8. Are you habitually TMSing? Do you tend to get upset when things don’t work out right? Do you always try to do your best but feel no matter how hard you try it’s never good enough? Such habits of mind lead to further anxiety, stress, tension, strain and pain.

    9. When you help others in distress do you feel like you could or should have done more?

    10. Unconscious psychological conditioning that you were not even aware of is the problem, not the way you move, lie or sit.

    11. Practice thinking you’re not going to hurt each time before and after you do your conditioned activities like running, typing, exercising etc.

    12. Start to be aware of your thoughts.

    13. Start to expect that you won’t hurt each time you move in a conditioned way or else meditate on feeling and seeing yourself pain-free.

    Walt’s Journey - Chapter 5: Journaling 3: “Of Love and Sauerkraut”, pp. 131-142

    Again, Walt’s Chapter 5 is based largely on a series of personal vignettes he has taken from his TMS journaling assignments. Thematically, it weaves together a series of incidents involving personal betrayal by tenants, friends and family members that lead his forgiving those who have gone out of their way to take advantage of his good nature. There’s Jake and Fran that Walt describes as the “Couple from Hell” who deliberately trashed the apartment Walt rented them in order to avoid paying rent. There’s Ed, the future do-nothing politician, who took Walt for a $2 grand advance while performing no work in return. And there’s even his dictatorial mother who arbitrarily threw out all of his high school momentos but who he felt guilty about being unable to take care of during his last years. Through this spiritual progression from anger to compassion, Walt also works his way back to an admittedly flawed Catholic Church. Incidentally, this isn't very far from the same position many divines, like John Donne or Jonathan Swift, have come to by separating the ideal Church from the visible Church. Walt ends this chapter with a parable worthy of Aesop about Lawrence Anthony, the “Elephant Whisperer” and the extremely intelligent and compassionate animals he champion for so long that illustrates the little understood intuitive, empathetic connection between the minds of men and animals.

    This is just some of the notes but I believe you will thank me for them after you get used to the concepts and techniques and make it all a part of your life,
    Bless you
    Last edited: May 31, 2014
  12. JulieB

    JulieB New Member


    Sorry for the long delay, but I wanted to thank you so much for your comments. I will read and re-read them. I am also planning on buying your book as soon as I finish with the ones I am currently reading. You are an inspiration and I thank you again.

    Eric "Herbie" Watson likes this.

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