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Knee Pain, again

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Brooke, Jan 7, 2013.

  1. Brooke

    Brooke New Member

    Hello everyone. I posted on this forum years ago for back pain and am very familiar with the tenets of this program.

    For the past three months I have been dealing with knee pain. It has been a slow development (actually about 2.5 years ago it started hurting, but never kept me from my activities until this fall) but now is really slowing me down. My P.T is amazing--looks at things from a spiritual and emotional perspective, as well as physical. He agrees that my lingering back pain is not structurally caused (though, of course, my structure has been affected by the deeper issues I grapple with subconsciously). That said, he said I have patella-femoral syndrome. I thought at first, oh this is just another TMS manifestation. But, it is true: the VMO (muscle on the inside of my thigh) is about half the size on the right leg as the left. Also, after activity, there is a small amount of swelling and it is warm. Hmmmm.....I did nothing dramatic to injure the area and am the classic TMS personality. We just moved to a rural part of Oregon, I had a baby a year ago, and am starting a new job tomorrow. SO, it seems like there is plenty of stress in my body, but the physical manifestations sure do look like an injury.

    So I wonder: has anyone else had something similar with their knees?

    Thank you so much! And thank you administrators for this incredibly supportive service.
    Sienna likes this.
  2. Jilly

    Jilly Well known member

    I dont know about your injury specifically, but my daughter had a very bad knee injury related to sports she was 16 at the time, now 18 years old. The injury caused a loud pop (that we heard from the bleachers) and severely stretched and partially torn MCL & ACL & LCL. The doctor was good, he didn't want to jump right into surgery, give it time to heal and PT. She did heal, but during times of high stress the knee will ache.

    Just yesterday sitting in the car doing nothing it began to ache. I asked her what was she thinking about and as it turns out she was stressed out about starting college in a few weeks and moving. So I worked with her concerns and within minutes the knee pain shifted to the non injured knee. We kept talking and she continued to express herself and then the next thing the pain lifted and the aches went away. She said.."It always helps to talk to you mom" I said, " I can't take all the credit, you got it out of your system all on your own" ( * with help from Dr. Sarno !) We didn't solve anything, we acknowledged her fears and worries and allowed the pain to move through her body and not become frozen or trapped there.

    Remember reading Dr. Sarno ... Patients coming into the office with pain but demonstrated no changes since the last MRI, so what was causing their pain ? Repressed emotions, the principle emotion of rage. Remember there are many structural changes that occur as we age and are a normal part of living and should not cause pain. Just having a baby your body went through many changes ... and continues to settle back into pre-baby stages.

    Being a new mom, moving to a new rural area, and a new job is a lot for anyone. Were you forced to move due to the economy or did you leave behind your dream home ? Do you like your new home and neighborhood or do you miss friends and family ? Is the job in your field of choice ? Are you anticipating new workplace drama and a new boss ? Is your new baby sleeping through the night yet ? Be true to yourself here, there is A LOT to be stressed out over and I barely scratched the surface.

    If you have Dr. Sarno's books, pull them out and start reading them. I think you forgot how to think psychologically and how stressful life can be. There is a lot going on in your life right now ! * hugs

  3. Brooke

    Brooke New Member

    I have been meaning to reply all week and THANK YOU for such a helpful post. Indeed, this transition has been very difficult and stressful and I realize the potential for it to cause/increase TMS symptoms. Actually, I'd be surprised if something didn't pop up, as I am aware of the resentment I have toward my husband for taking a job out here, for leaving our home, our community, our friends--my support! But the nature of this issue just seems so physical. And the doctor I've been seeing (who is very holistic and agrees that most of my issues stem from emotions) seems to think it now may be a problem with my meniscus. This makes me worry, just right into thoughts about surgery, etc. Either way, I know I will benefit from some honest introspection. I just need to stay out of the worry wheel that I can feel happening around this knee.

    If anyone has had TMS success based around a diagnosis about a meniscus strain or tear, I'd love to hear it!

    Thanks again Jilly. I find our posts inspiring! I too take this whole life thing too seriously most days.
  4. Jilly

    Jilly Well known member

    Once you have insurance I'd say get the MRI and see if there is a tear. It will be interesting to see the results of the MRI because you didn't have an 'event' or 'accident' prior to the pain developing. Then, when you hear the words... " I can't find anything wrong, the MRI is normal " you'll smile and know it's the TMS.

    But get it checked out. Like you said, stay out of the worry wheel and do your TMS work, thinking psychologically, being mindful, and taking time for yourself. You've been dealing with A LOT ! How is the new job ? Keep us posted ! I hope someone with a meniscus injury speaks up, maybe put up a new post directly asking ... I need help with meniscus experiences
  5. tarala

    tarala Well known member

    Hi Brooke,

    Many many years ago I had knee pain diagnosed as a miniscus problem. I had had long time sciatica, but the knee seemed to come out of nowhere. Finally after a year I had laproscopic surgery. It made absolutely no difference. About six months later, the pain disappeared. Once every two or three years it pops up a tiny bit, but now I just think of it as TMS, and it goes away. Of course, everyone is different, but at least in my case I believe it was TMS.
    Jilly likes this.
  6. Jilly

    Jilly Well known member

    Today, at breakfast, the table near us (2) men were speaking about their knee's going out. The one man said, he never injured it and doesn't know why it goes out once a year. The other man, said the same thing...had the full work up...nothing wrong with it! I had to restrain myself not to go over and start chatting about TMS ! Glad to hear your knee is good. ;)
  7. tarala

    tarala Well known member

    Thanks Jilly. Oh to have known long ago what I know now ...
  8. nickserpa1

    nickserpa1 Newcomer

    hello, my name is nick serpa im 29 years old. I used to suffer from bad lower back pain and upper back pain to the point I couldn't do anything active I read john e sarnos book and the pain vanished it was completely gone. I also have had around 10-11 knee dislocation but never really had pain in my knee for long it usually got better really fast but this time it was getting worse and worse I had knee surgery and they look inside with a scope and couldnt see nothing wrong but they tighten up my knee cap with a lateral release and medial plication procedure. I also havent been able to walk for 10 months now due to the pain in my knee I have lost most of the muscle in my left leg. Now the past few months I started noticing pain in my other knee aswell the right one it went away after a few months tho. What i wanted to ask you is on my MRI results it says i had mucoid degeneration with a small joint effusion and a distal anterior femur injury but it has been so long since my MRI like 3 months and also my left leg has been reddish purple when i stand up especially my foot it doesnt look that good of a coulour. What do you think i really think most of it is phychosomatic (tms) thx for ur time.:). the pain also feels like a tingly burning sensation my foot is a little numb most of the time when im relaxing and the pain is behind my knee cap most of the time.
    Sienna likes this.
  9. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi, Nick. I am not a doctor so I can't say your pain is definitely TMS and not structural, but if I had your pain I would avoid any more surgery.
    I think your pain is moving around because that's typically what happens in TMS. The subconscious moves pain around so that we work on discovering its emotional causes. Have you done the Structured Educational Program? It's free in the subforum on this web site, and takes you through short daily steps toward discovering the TMS repressed emotions that cause pain.

    You are very fortunate that your earlier back pain went away so quickly after reading Dr. Sarno and learning about TMS. You probably did not get really into the emotional causes of your pain and they have come back. The SEP, especially journaling, can help you discover those harmful emotions. Dr. Sarno says we don't even have to solve those emotional problems, just recognize them, and total belief in TMS will heal us.

    I would not let MRIs worry me. Dr. Sarno says most results about disc degeneration do not cause pain. The pain may be there, but it is not caused by anything structural. It's TMS.
  10. nickserpa1

    nickserpa1 Newcomer

    thank you soo soo much walt ive read so many threads and am convinced its tms today i got red on one crutch.:) i will worl on the SED .
  11. nickserpa1

    nickserpa1 Newcomer

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