Help me ideate on a business to help people with TMS!

[Mitzie]

This isn't something for you to consider now but I supervise clinical psychology students as part of my role. We're often looking for research projects they can get involved in.

Hi Nora and everyone...my first thought was therapists! Reach out to NASW and pitch your idea..or maybe a school..I'm in my second year of grad school for social work at the University of Kentucky. (I'm actually in Rhode Island..it's an online program) I'd be happy to ask one of my professors if they would like to chat with you. I started getting into social work because like you I wanted to help people..and I'd like to be a TMS therapist in Rhode Island..as I have yet to find one. Especially one who takes low income or state insurance.

 

[nora97]

@Mitzie Hi! Thanks for your reply. I'm always trying to learn what tools people would want to use / be helpful. It sounds like maybe a TMS therapist finding tool would be helpful?

 

[JanAtheCPA]

sounds like maybe a TMS therapist finding tool would be helpful?

It's the most frequent question/request we get for which the existing resources are minimal. I've learned from Forest that the biggest roadblock to maintaining a current database of legitimate practitioners is the vetting process. That's why the database on our wiki is not updated with new practitioners, because we don't have anyone willing to put in the time to properly assess new submissions. If an app or site could be designed with AI to take over that process (and require regular updates) it seems that would provide a very desirable service.

 

[nora97]

It's the most frequent question/request we get for which the existing resources are minimal. I've learned from Forest that the biggest roadblock to maintaining a current database of legitimate practitioners is the vetting process. That's why the database on our wiki is not updated with new practitioners, because we don't have anyone willing to put in the time to properly assess new submissions. If an app or site could be designed with AI to take over that process (and require regular updates) it seems that would provide a very desirable service.

thank you Jan! This is helpful. I am wondering if you’ve heard of or tried Lin Health or Menda? I believe they have some sort of network of mind-body clinicians - so I’m curious if that ever came up / what is missing.

 

[Mitzie]

@Mitzie Hi! Thanks for your reply. I'm always trying to learn what tools people would want to use / be helpful. It sounds like maybe a TMS therapist finding tool would be helpful?

Hi..yes..and also I'm wondering if therapist's are hesitant to say TMS is one of their approaches..or if getting TMS into curriculums is a good place to start.

 

[Cactusflower]

thank you Jan! This is helpful. I am wondering if you’ve heard of or tried Lin Health or Menda? I believe they have some sort of network of mind-body clinicians - so I’m curious if that ever came up / what is missing.

Some of my husbands clients have access to these two services. I think they are pretty much trained by Alan Gordon. Pain Reprocessing is a common term that is used. They base their findings on a faulty nervous system and stay away from the subject of emotions.

 

[JanAtheCPA]

I've only ever heard the names, but a brief search looks like they are operating similarly to Alan's Pain Psychology Center, each with a proprietary network of practitioners. Menda is associated with Les Aria, who's been around the TMS world for awhile.

 

[Duggit]

Some of my husbands clients have access to these two services. I think they are pretty much trained by Alan Gordon. Pain Reprocessing is a common term that is used. They base their findings on a faulty nervous system and stay away from the subject of emotions.

Actually Alan Gordon’s Pain Reprocessing Therapy does not "stay away from the subject of emotions." Gordon’s Treatment Outline for Pain Reprocessing Therapy (https://www.painreprocessingtherapy...1/03/PRT-Supplementary-Materials-for-Site.pdf) is organized under four Roman numerals. The fourth one is
"Addressing other emotional threats.” “Other” means other than the emotion of fear. The discussion of other emotional threats in the Treatment Outline includes in part the following:

"PRT thus aims to lower a person’s overall threat level. This can include helping someone process threatening emotions, a history of trauma, difficult relationships, and more. . . . Techniques for expressing, disclosing, and processing difficult emotions from several relevant therapeutic approaches (e.g., emotional awareness and expression therapy) can be used for this component of PRT.”
​

Emotional awareness and expression therapy was created and scientifically tested by Alan Gordon’s good friend and colleague in the Boulder Back Pain study of PRT for back pain, i.e., by Dr. Howard Schubiner.

 

[Mitzie]

If an app or site could be designed with AI to take over that process (and require regular updates) it seems that would provide a very desirable service.

Jan..this is a great idea! Right now I'm searching and searching for a TMS therapist to do my grad school practicum with and it's a struggle. An app that I could use to find a LCSW who is using a TMS approach is something I would download, and probably pay for, in a second.

 

[nora97]

Hi folks! I just wanted to share an update for those that have followed my journey on this thread

I actually share a lot more about my personal story & the business I've created (inspired by this forum) in Sean Hershey's podcast here: https://open.spotify.com/episode/1Jwt7bFYbZIauA4VXmHxYh (S3 E11 | Fully Recovered from Chronic Back Pain, IBS, and Insomnia with Nervana App Co-Founder Nora Rodden)

@JanAtheCPA remember when you referred me to Sean Hershey's podcast with Nicole Sachs? Full circle!!!

Also, @Ellen - I call you out and thank you in the middle of the podcast! 31:50 and 35:37

Very grateful for this community!

 

[Mani]

Same. I knew I had anxiety and OCD as a child and teen and no one helped me. It was just like it was a part of me and no one told me I could fix it. As a child I had many headaches and stomach pain that I now see as TMS. Learning to work with emotions would have helped me so much as child. I'll be approaching my sister about TMS when I visit her this summer (we live in different states). She has many TMS symptoms but I wouldn't have know if I didn't stumble onto TMS. And who knows if she will be open to it? That was a huge stumbling block for me when I first learned about. I finally surrendered when I knew no one else could help me.

This is crazy to read because im the exact same. My mom also sometimes had to pick me up from school because i suddenly got terrible stomach cramps. Or my teacher would call her and tell her i was running very pale. My mom'd tell me that i had nothing or that i wasnt sick and i didnt really know what to do with that obviously, i was 8. But it was incredible to me that this awfulness manifested itself at such an incredibly young age. And because i never really spoke to my parents about what was going on with me (you know, the i dont feel anything i dont need anything i just exist), they didnt know something was going on. They also didnt act on the very apparent symptoms like me crying that ISIS was gonna crucify me and burn me at the stake. They must have just felt like it was regular child anxiety or whatever.

I also never told my parents that id always be lying awake for three hours post bed time just doing absolutely nothing but thinking. I didnt know that people were supposed to fall asleep. I had to be told to close my eyes to fall asleep at 8yo. I still had the same sleeping issues after, but before that i didnt know that you could just close your eyes softly like that, i had to be told. I still remember those belly cramps as one of the worst pains ive been through and other than existing there was absolutely nothing wrong with me physically.

 

[Diana-M]

i never really spoke to my parents about what was going on with me (you know, the i dont feel anything i dont need anything i just exist)

This is the crux of TMS. Mani, this is a great journaling prompt for you. I’d dig down into this horrible feeling (which I share with you, btw). This is a lot to overcome, but it’s what we have to change in order to heal.

 

[Mani]

This is the crux of TMS. Mani, this is a great journaling prompt for you. I’d dig down into this horrible feeling (which I share with you, btw). This is a lot to overcome, but it’s what we have to change in order to heal.

How would you have me journal about this?

Any specific ideas? What is the specific journaling prompt?

 

[Diana-M]

How would you have me journal about this?

Any specific ideas? What is the specific journaling prompt?

I’d write as your 8 year old self, and just see what comes out. I’d ask, “Why don’t you feel anything?” “Why don’t you need anything?” “Why do you feel numb? Why do you only exist?” Then, I’d ask your current self the same questions. Stick with it. Keep writing (or have multiple sessions), until you actually get out of your head and into your heart. Try and FEEL what you write.

 

[Mani]

I’d write as your 8 year old self, and just see what comes out. I’d ask, “Why don’t you feel anything?” “Why don’t you need anything?” “Why do you feel numb? Why do you only exist?” Then, I’d ask your current self the same questions. Stick with it. Keep writing (or have multiple sessions), until you actually get out of your head and into your heart. Try and FEEL what you write.

Wait just so were clear.

I just write as if i am writing in my diary as an 8 yo? Do you have like an example? Lol this is pretty awkward but im trying to do this but i dont know what to write

 

[Diana-M]

Wait just so were clear.

I just write as if i am writing in my diary as an 8 yo? Do you have like an example? Lol this is pretty awkward but im trying to do this but i dont know what to write

Yeah…that’s it. It’s going to be really hard because your 8 year old isn’t used to being loved and heard. You might have to coax him out. Just acknowledge him. That’s a good start. If he can’t answer those questions, see if he wants to talk to you about anything. What makes him happy? Sad? Just let the writing lead you. Don’t try and control it. There are no wrong answers.

(How? Close your eyes. Think about being that age. Draw up some memories. Then, just be open. Listen. Your little self will talk. Yes, it’s weird. But it’s real. My inner children have revealed to me all sorts of things. Recent example: the pain of missing my mom when she went back to work when I was 5 and I was home with my abusive father. I felt sheer, total, complete terror and helplessness.

You also might have some luck answering the questions as yourself today. That could get the ball rolling. And if nothing comes… maybe just think about it for a while. It will ruminate down inside and come out when it wants to.

 

[Mani]

Yeah…that’s it. It’s going to be really hard because your 8 year old isn’t used to being loved and heard. You might have to coax him out. Just acknowledge him. That’s a good start. If he can’t answer those questions, see if he wants to talk to you about anything. What makes him happy? Sad? Just let the writing lead you. Don’t try and control it. There are no wrong answers.

(How? Close your eyes. Think about being that age. Draw up some memories. Then, just be open. Listen. Your little self will talk. Yes, it’s weird. But it’s real. My inner children have revealed to me all sorts of things. Recent example: the pain of missing my mom when she went back to work when I was 5 and I was home with my abusive father. I felt sheer, total, complete terror and helplessness.

You also might have some luck answering the questions as yourself today. That could get the ball rolling. And if nothing comes… maybe just think about it for a while. It will ruminate down inside and come out when it wants to.

Ok so i go over the questions you wrote and answer them in a diary fashion and make a nice story out of this? I'll just give it a try, we'll see what happens.

Thanks

 

[Diana-M]

make a nice story out of this?

Well it might not be a “nice” story. in fact, I venture to guess it isn’t a nice story. it’s not how an 8-year-old normally feels. The main idea is you want to learn how to feel— anything— in your body. Try to get past intellectualizing emotions. TMSers short circuit emotions and stuff them. We learned it as children as a protection. And that’s how you keep filling up your rage bucket, which overflows into symptoms. So you want to learn how to feel; how to tap it off, and let it dissipate. You want to stop storing repressed emotions in your body. You want to learn how to start telling yourself the truth about how you feel—- Currently, and from the past. (I’m going to open a new thread about this topic because we are hijacking this thread that belongs to another topic. It will also make it easier to find this discussion later.) Keep an eye out. I’ll start the new thread right now.

 

[Diana-M]

Here’s the new thread @Mani
https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/threads/talking-to-your-inner-child-and-pain-relief.33122/