Dr Hanscom

[Beckie]

Hi everyone I'm new here, in 2009 I had a spinal fusion L4/L5 after 30 plus years of back pain. Compared with a lot of people I have read about I did get some relief but it never really settled, anyway, I found Healing back pain and it all made sense, I have been following Alan and found these articles really helpful and was beginning to grow in confidence that I could get through this. I have been told that the fusion is putting stress in the joint above and this is where I now get most of my pain. In November last year I got really bad knee pain and went to see a surgeon was really relieved I didnt need a knee replacement and was diagnosed with chondromalacia patella....great as I remembered Dr Sarno saying this was tms. I haven't let it bother me but the last few months I've been getting leg pain and cramp too but still I thought of Dr Sarno and managed to not panic as I do with my back pain, that is until last night. I haven't slept and decided to write a post to get some help from you all. I sent away for Back in Control by David Hansom on page 35 he writes "Lumbar 3 nerve pain down the front of the leg can Be similar to pain caused under the kneecap (chondromalacia patella).... I have this leg pain...."I have seen several patients who underwent knee arthroscopy before they realised it was a pinched L3 nerve root. An L3 decompressive surgery solves it each time". So now I'm panicking it's a "real" thing that needs surgery I understand we see things on the MRI and the pain can be where we feel it but it's still tms. But, Dr Hanscom deals with tms/mindbody so that's really sent my mind going, all my hard work all my confidence has just left me and I am scared in fact I am crying as I write this and the pain in my leg is so much worse...I would really appreciate some input from you. Thank you this is a wonderful site.
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[Praxeologist]

Hey I also have been reading this book and the same passage freaked me out. What exactly is he saying about chondromalacia as it relates to the Lumbar 3 nerve pain? Is Hanscom right about the assertions he makes that sometimes chronic pain can be solved by the correct surgery?

 

[MindBodyPT]

Hi all,

Don't panic, everyone! This situation is very rare compared to the number of people with TMS. Of course it can happen but not frequently at all! In the rare few it happens to, the symptoms would have to match up EXACTLY with the spinal nerve root L3 symptoms. Often it would not just be pain but other things too. A good MD or even PT could tell the difference between knee pain (that is really likely to be TMS in the case of patella pain) or the rare case of a true nerve pinch. Please don't think this is your situation, it was just an example of getting the right diagnosis.

 

[Lunarlass66]

Hi all,

Don't panic, everyone! This situation is very rare compared to the number of people with TMS. Of course it can happen but not frequently at all! In the rare few it happens to, the symptoms would have to match up EXACTLY with the spinal nerve root L3 symptoms. Often it would not just be pain but other things too. A good MD or even PT could tell the difference between knee pain (that is really likely to be TMS in the case of patella pain) or the rare case of a true nerve pinch. Please don't think this is your situation, it was just an example of getting the right diagnosis.

I often have pain in my right knee too.. Burning and stiffness, especially at night, but strangely enough it dissipates after I get up and move around.. I too am fearful that all my aches and pains are because of my L3 level borderline stenosis, arthritis and bulged discs at multiple levels, even though the doctor told me "normal wear and tear"... I think having had a lumbar discectomy at L4-5 in 1995 has accelerated the degenerative changes in my spine... Im only 51. I also wonder, though it may be a stretch and I'm no doctor if menopause and the loss of estrogen has somehow worsened my pain, ability to tolerate pain or actually affected the structure of my spine somehow...
Mindbody PT is a wonderful source of info and support, btw... Thank you for lending your expertise to the forum!

 

[MindBodyPT]

I often have pain in my right knee too.. Burning and stiffness, especially at night, but strangely enough it dissipates after I get up and move around.. I too am fearful that all my aches and pains are because of my L3 level borderline stenosis, arthritis and bulged discs at multiple levels, even though the doctor told me "normal wear and tear"... I think having had a lumbar discectomy at L4-5 in 1995 has accelerated the degenerative changes in my spine... Im only 51. I also wonder, though it may be a stretch and I'm no doctor if menopause and the loss of estrogen has somehow worsened my pain, ability to tolerate pain or actually affected the structure of my spine somehow...
Mindbody PT is a wonderful source of info and support, btw... Thank you for lending your expertise to the forum!

Happy to help! I don't think your situation applies to the L3 issue...this is RARE and would be pretty obvious on imaging and also EXACTLY match the symptoms with no deviation! Nerve roots have extremely specific symptoms (motor and sensory) that go with them and this should not vary based on time of day, relaxation, etc. Menopause and loss of estrogen will not cause worsened pain or affect the structure of the spine. As you know some women who are post-menopausal will have more osteoporosis (anywhere in their body) but this would never cause pain.

Hope you are able to find confidence in your TMS diagnosis over time and relax a bit about the stenosis and such, lots of people have it...bodies are weird and strange stuff always turns up on MRI, vast majority of it means nothing. I'm only 30 and I had a strange "mass" on my liver on my lumbar MRI one time, they did bloodwork and more imaging and of course it was nothing, just a benign cyst. We all have stuff like this no matter what our age.

 

[Lunarlass66]

Happy to help! I don't think your situation applies to the L3 issue...this is RARE and would be pretty obvious on imaging and also EXACTLY match the symptoms with no deviation! Nerve roots have extremely specific symptoms (motor and sensory) that go with them and this should not vary based on time of day, relaxation, etc. Menopause and loss of estrogen will not cause worsened pain or affect the structure of the spine. As you know some women who are post-menopausal will have more osteoporosis (anywhere in their body) but this would never cause pain.

Hope you are able to find confidence in your TMS diagnosis over time and relax a bit about the stenosis and such, lots of people have it...bodies are weird and strange stuff always turns up on MRI, vast majority of it means nothing. I'm only 30 and I had a strange "mass" on my liver on my lumbar MRI one time, they did bloodwork and more imaging and of course it was nothing, just a benign cyst. We all have stuff like this no matter what our age.

Thanks so much Mindbody PT for your knowledgeable replies. They are a great antidote for the anxiety that invariably comes with TMS. I truly hope you're able to get the message out there to your more traditional colleagues and maybe even start a more holistic private practice in the future. If I might add a heartfelt congratulations on the upcoming addition to your family! Kids are awesome! That was my career for over 30 years!

 

[MindBodyPT]

Thanks for the good wishes lunarlass! As far as my coworkers I don't stand much chance...I've floated some simple ideas of TMS by them to test it out and they have responded poorly. They really all think people with unexplained chronic pain are bullshitting! It's so tough. I had one PT friend who was into it though! I believe you have to be ready and open to change your beliefs. The holistic practice is definitely in my future but I'm biding my time for now and focused on the "upcoming addition!" I look forward to spending some time as parent to a little one. My career is pretty early still so solo practice is a goal for the 5-10 year range hopefully when I have slightly older kids or maybe sooner if it works out!