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Define "Pain"

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by muzzo909, Mar 5, 2014.

  1. muzzo909

    muzzo909 New Member

    Hi everyone,
    I have a question about the pain that is associated with TMS. Is the pain that people feel, with regards to TMS, always severe in nature? Meaning, does it have to be debilitating or can the pain be more like an ache or soreness? The pain that I am suffering from is more like a constant soreness rather than severe. It gets sorer the more physical I am during the day, but then subsides with rest. I've been diagnosed with degenerative disk disease but, according to Dr. Sarno, this condition can manifest symptoms related to TMS.
    Thanks in advance!
  2. Ellen

    Ellen Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi muzzo909,

    TMS can be mild pain, like an ache or soreness, as you describe. That's pretty much how I would describe the pain I still have, though it has been severe at times. But TMS can also take many other forms besides pain. As you read through the posts on this forum, you'll see all the different ways TMS can manifest.

    Welcome to the forum! Please continue to ask questions any time and keep us updated on how you're doing. You'll find a warm and helpful community here. Let us know how we can help.
    North Star likes this.
  3. jazzhands

    jazzhands Peer Supporter

    It can be all over the place...in my experience I have gone from a 1 at times to a 7 or 8 out of 10 in terms of pain before I finally found out about TMS and was cured.
  4. North Star

    North Star Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi Muzzo909, my pain is usually all over the board. At times most wearing aspect is the chronicity of it. I used to get headaches lasting a month. Sometimes they'd really flare and then it was time to put a pillow over my head an whimper.:hurting: The frequency and severity of those headaches has diminished since learning of TMS, btw.

    My other biggies are tendon pain which are as random as they come. Or GERD. Again…all across the board, depending on what's going! Pain could worsen with activity or with sitting on my butt all day!

    As you learn about TMS, don't be surprised if those symptoms start moving around and changing in intensity. Just keep reminding yourself it's all part of TMS.

    And welcome to the community, btw!
  5. muzzo909

    muzzo909 New Member

    Thank you all for the replies and for your own personal stories. The area that is affected is my lower back. It never moves around in location. I would say it ranges from a 2 to a 7 in "soreness". Kind of like a muscle tightening. And this is usually in proportion to how much physical labor I expel throughout the day (due to my profession). If I stretch it feels better but does not go away. I try and limit the amount if physical work I do during the day as not to aggravate my lower back.
    I guess my concern is that I never have debilitating episodes from "severe" pain, just more of an uncomfortable daily life from soreness and tightness.
    I am new to the the theory of TMS and I am trying to get a better understanding of it.
    North Star likes this.
  6. North Star

    North Star Beloved Grand Eagle

    You're doing just great, Muzzo909. Stick around here and you'll learn lots more! Please keep us posted. :)
    muzzo909 likes this.
  7. nancy

    nancy Well known member

    Oh Boy, now I'm starting to wonder? My pain can be a 9 out of ten sometimes, but is always
    there after I've been up a few hrs?? Anyone have really searing pain. Mine is in my (r) hip and
    both legs, usually the (r) leg but can be both. I need to stop thinking, as we all know that's not
    always so easy. I have no interest in seeking medical help as have done this for yrs with no
    answers. What to do?
  8. nancy

    nancy Well known member

    I am worried about this, anyone know about rsd? I only have pain upon standing or walking, non
    when I lay down??
  9. Pingman

    Pingman Well known member

    My pain has always been more soreness and constant vs severe. The anxiety that follows the pain for me has by far been worse than the physical pain.
  10. Steve Ozanich

    Steve Ozanich TMS Consultant

    Pain is an unpleasant sensation.
    North Star likes this.
  11. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi, Nancy.
    I'm glad you don't feel pain when lying down, but hope you won't do that too often during the day.
    Dr. Sarno and Steve and others say it's good to walk or stand in pain, so as not to give in to it.
    You also don't want to condition yourself that walking or standing causes the pain.

    Easier said than done, I know.

    Steve says pain is any unpleasant sensation. So it's like paying the bills.
    North Star likes this.
  12. nancy

    nancy Well known member

    Hi Walt, good to hear from you. I very rarely even sit, just to go on my pc. I was never
    one to take naps, I love to move. I guess my question was do others get severe pain
    instead of just soreness. My legs start to hurt very badly by 4-5 pm but I just go about
    my business in pain. They used to hurt from the moment I got up so maybe I'm making
    progress. I hope you are feeling well and I'm ordering your next book very soon, I've
    had a lot going on here for the past two months, now I want to read something that's not
    about tms! God Bless, Nancy
    North Star likes this.
  13. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi, Nancy. Great to hear from you. I'm doing fine. I keep active too and like being busy.
    Not too busy but just enough. It sounds like you're definitely making progress with your legs.

    The book I've written with Herbie about our TMS journeys is finished and Becca is helping a lot
    with getting the manuscript in the proper format for publication. So it should be ready soon
    and Forest says he will let everyone know. It's called GOD DOES NOT WANT YOU TO BE IN PAIN.

    But definitely read about things other than TMS. We can think too much and work too hard on
    our healing.

    If you like "cozy" mysteries, you might enjoy my humorous murder novel,
    THE MURDER-OF-THE-MONTH CLUB. It's available in paperback at amazon.com books
    under my name, Walter Oleksy. Just a suggestion.

    God bless you, too.
  14. nancy

    nancy Well known member

    I was also wanting to read your book concerning all the famous people, what was the
    name of that book again? Murder of the month sounds great too as I could use a little
    humor in my life right now!
  15. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    nancy, my book with the famous is called
    CHRISTMAS WITH THE FAMOUS, also available at amazon.com books.

    I write about the most memorable Christmas of 150 famous people.
    It's after the holiday now but the stories are very heartwarming and some are funny.
  16. chickenbone

    chickenbone Well known member

    I agree completely with North Star and Ellen, great comments. Nancy, my pain sounds a lot like yours when it gets bad which is less often now. My pain is right leg and right buttock, kind of like sciatic pain. I get burning and discomfort. And I also get bouts of weird forms of GERD.

    Steve is right that pain can be defined as any unpleasant sensation. But I think that there is a lot of unpleasant"body noise" that us TMS'ers get our minds wrapped around and that is what makes it persist. We get a stitch or something and think "OMG what is that??, something must be wrong" or "Oh No, that is starting again". It sticks in our minds and generates fear and then we get the sensation each time we think of it. It starts with body noise that most people without TMS would hardly notice or give a second thought to. I have been monitoring myself and have noticed that, each time my "main" symptom shifts (the "main symptom" is the one that my mind is using to distract me and get my attention at any given moment), my mind has already decided to drop the last one and starts to attach fearful thoughts to the next one.

    I think a useful thing to do is to WATCH and CATCH your mind doing this as if your mind was separate from you. Just observe. "There it goes again - I saw that happen, now my (insert symptom from the list) will be the one my mind will think is a catastrophe. The pain will vary in direct proportion to the amount of negative emotional energy I give it." And on and on.
  17. Steve Ozanich

    Steve Ozanich TMS Consultant

    This is a good point to be made. When several of the mindbody docs were reviewing my manuscript they wrote in by hand in margins,
    "unpleasant symptoms" at various spots. The idea is that the brain creates something unpleasant, it doesn't really matter what it is. The point is for the brain to create "something" for the person to worry about, or be concerned about, and to obsess on--in order to divert the focus from the anxiety. The focus is most often on the "fear of" the symptoms, not on the sensation alone.

    But--there's still too much focus on the symptoms for people to heal. "As long as he is concerned with what his body is doing, his symptoms will continue." JS, HBP.

    It's important to feel the body sensation, and then to immediately focus on why it's there--what necessitated it to form, and to stop describing its characteristics. This is easier said than done though, I have trouble getting people to stop talking about body. I know people are healed, or are healing, when they only talk about life and relationship, purpose and light. It's a process of transformation, not an event.

    tigerlilly likes this.
  18. chickenbone

    chickenbone Well known member

    Very good, Steve.
  19. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi Walt, just ordered your books on Amazon for my gf. She's a voracious mystery reader and also loves Christmas. I'm a slow reader, it's taken me two years to finish SteveO's GPD, and now I'm going to get back to Nicole Sach's "TRUTH".


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