1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
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Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Tennis Tom, Oct 17, 2016.

  1. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Page ix, Foreword by Paul Gwozdz. MD :

    "I want to emphasize how important having confidence in Dr. Sarno's teachings is to the healing process. Please note that I use the term "confidence" instead of "faith" since Dr. Sarno is not teaching religion."
    MrRage likes this.
  2. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    page 1: "...he (Dr. Sarno) began to look more deeply into his patients' charts where he noticed that his back pain patients also had many other things going on with their health. In addition to back pain, many had bouts of shoulder and hip pain, knee pain, foot and hand pain, skin problems, anxiety, depression, migraines, ulcers, irritable bowel, heartburn, frequent urination, and allergies, etc."
  3. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    page 2:

    "The most important concept to understand in healing back pain is the power of belief. What you believe will determine how bad or how long you will suffer, or whether you will ever heal."
    Ines and Eric "Herbie" Watson like this.
  4. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Steve's new book is terrific. It says it all, and he's right in continuing physical activity.

    And he's right in calling it "confidence" in TMS, if "belief" is too spiritual for some people.
    Tennis Tom likes this.
  5. Wavy Soul

    Wavy Soul Peer Supporter

    Wow - TT is here and SteveO has a new book. I’m glad I dropped by. I’m feeling like crap, but oh well. I think I’ll order the book right away.
  6. MrRage

    MrRage Peer Supporter

    Most people aren't really willing to accept 'faith healing' because there is no sc
  7. balto

    balto Beloved Grand Eagle

    It took me many months after I read doctor Sarno's book to really understand what he want me to do to heal. He want us to believe in his diagnosis, he want us to realize that tms symptoms are reversible and benign. What he really want us to achieve is: DO NOT FEAR OUR SYMPTOMS.
    no fear no pain. We can never never heal if we still fear our symptoms no matter what methods we're are using or which teachers we are believing in. We can journal every day for years, we can meditate 10 hours every day for years, no matter what we try to do, if fear of our symptoms still exist we will not heal.
    After realizing that all my mind body syndromes are history.
    mike2014, Trellis, Tennis Tom and 2 others like this.
  8. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    This is the essence of Ron Siegel's book Back Sense. No repressed emotions, no distraction theory, no inner children or bullies, just this: fear (and anxiety) create muscle tension. Muscle tension creates pain, often severe. Pain, in turn, ramps up fear and anxiety. The fear/pain/fear cycle. So the only way to break the cycle is to overcome the fear.
    ezer likes this.
  9. tgirl

    tgirl Well known member

    Maybe that's part of my problem. I only partially believe that my nervous feeling and prickly hypersensitive legs sensation are psychological. My mind keeps going back to 'doctors missed something and I actually have some sort of autoimmune/autonomic disorder'. Very distressing...
  10. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    What created the fear?
  11. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    So, are you saying Ron Siegel got it right and Dr. Sarno is wrong? Repressed emotions, creating structural or affective TMS symptoms, as a distraction from having to deal with overwhelming life issues (see Holmes-Rahe list), are not the cause of TMS/psychosomatic pain? And that "anxiety" is not a TMS affective symptom, but the cause of the TMS pain symptom?
  12. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    I see no need to get into that debate. It isn't helpful to anyone. There's a whole 'nother forum full of those debates if anyone cares.

    My point rather was that from a different perspective, another mindbody clinician came to the same conclusion that Balto observes: losing fear is crucial. This is meant to reinforce the message which in fact resonates through many success stories: that whatever paradigm one finds most meaningful, fear is key. Relax, nobody is attacking Dr. Sarno.
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2016
    ezer likes this.
  13. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Quit being patronizing to me, I find it offensive. Looks like BeWell has pulled his posts and is gone from here--nice job on him. Where is the "other site" you mentioned, is it the Ron Siegel Back Sense site?Having several or more psychosomatic pain sites is a good thing--competition is good for survival of the species.
  14. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    It's my fault BeWell apparently posted something offensive (I didn't see it) and was censored by the mods and reacted childishly by taking his toys and going home? Oh please, Tom, that is unworthy of you. And you of course know what forum I am referring to, you have thousands of posts there. Anyhow, again, feel free to have the last word, I don't think these discourses help anyone but if you are going to misconstrue what I said as an attack on Dr. Sarno then I feel I should respond at least once by pointing out that that was not at all my intent.
    ezer likes this.
  15. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Thank you no offense taken, I just don't want you to inadvertently disseminate any non factual tautolaogical paradigms at a TMS site in honor of Dr. Sarno, that may unconsciously transform themselves into NOCEBOS for you or others.

    BeWell was not censored, (that was probably me for mentioning a form of O2 deprivation caused by placing one's cranium into one's rectal treasure chest--so to speak). He left here on his own accord, (SEE HIS BIO), after expressing his heartfelt views on TMS, and having to suppress and repress his emotions and getting the wind taken out of his sails--GOD forbid, anyone express any true emotions around a TMS site. I truly hope he reconsiders and comes back, this site could use the diversity he displayed in his all too brief visit.

    Last edited: Nov 1, 2016
  16. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    page 4,

    Dr. Sarno turned the world inside out with his keen observation that people unconsciously create their own pain in order to divert their awareness to their body distracting them away from their thoughts, feelings and emotions.
    tgirl likes this.
  17. Renee

    Renee Well known member

    I've often thought that muscle tension from anxiety/fear created my pelvic issues and not TMS. It is a viscious cycle. It makes sense to me since I believe a traumatic surgery when I was a child caused me to tighten the pelvic floor. No amount of pelvic physical therapy has ever helped because I can't release the anxiety I feel. How do you not feel anxious in this world?

    I know Dr. Sarno has written that anxiety is a TMS equivilant. I believe in TMS because I got rid of neck pain that I had for 1.5 years. But for example, I've had tinnitus since I was child. Just figured this was normal and never tried to do anything about it until I read that it is also a TMS equivilant. So I'm confused that it did not go away on it's own since I never sought treatment for it, and never really paid any attention to it.
  18. JanAtheCPA

    JanAtheCPA Beloved Grand Eagle

    Renee, this is the TMS mechanism doing its job. If I've learned one thing from doing this work, it is that the brain mechanism that Dr. Sarno labeled "TMS" is not really a condition to be cured - it's a very primitive brain mechanism that was designed to keep our primitive ancestors safe in a very unsafe world. It's not a very good mechanism, but at least it can be controlled with knowledge. What I like to say is that I've developed a different relationship with my TMS so that I'm no longer afraid of symptoms when they happen to appear, and if they get in the way, I know how to control or banish them so they no longer interfere with my life.

    I think that the idea behind the TMS mechanism is that if your consciousness is bogged down with emotional turmoil, you will not be paying attention to the sabre-tooth tiger waiting to eat you. So your brain suppresses negative and dangerous emotions and gives you a little bit of physical pain instead - just to keep you worried and on your toes.

    Does it work? Maybe in primitive times when the world was dangerous and life was short. But in today's relatively safe world, when we have to plan for lengthy lifespans, and when the daily distractions are relational, territorial or financial rather than life-and-death - not only is TMS not very effective, it can be very damaging for certain individuals. Add on to that the fact that today's distractions (relational, territorial, and financial) are kind of guaranteed to produce negative emotions - which means more stuff to be repressed by our brains. Which means more TMS symptoms being suffered - and it's no wonder we seem to have an epidemic of chronic conditions, anxiety, and depression.

    So the tinnitus is there because you have TMS. As does everyone. Your brain is constantly repressing stuff, whether it needs to or not. And yeah, anxiety is just another form of TMS - presumably because it's better to be generally anxious and worried about what's around you than to be totally distracted by deeper negative emotions. From my own personal experience, I believe that you have to conquer anxiety in order to conquer the rest of your TMS symptoms, because it feeds into the vicious cycle so well.

    Your confusion is not helped by the fact that the symptoms of TMS and the recovery from TMS are so different for each and every one of us.
    Ellen, plum, mike2014 and 1 other person like this.
  19. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    Regarding whether anxiety is a form of TMS, I have experienced panic attacks so bad that, had there been an option at the moment to choose dying, I would have taken it. Countless people have experienced and described the same. For myself, I do not believe for a minute that these somehow are a distraction from deeper negative emotions created by the brain or mind or what have you, in the same way that back pain and other somatic symptoms might be. Just my opinion and yes I am well aware of what certain books say, I've read them too.
  20. Renee

    Renee Well known member

    I realized that the panic attacks I have will never fully go away when last week I had to be in the front row of a large group of people for work. I normally sit in the very back so I can make my escape if necessary. As I was sitting down I looked back and the terror that I felt was as if I was on the ledge of a very tall building. I ended up taking half of a benzo that I carry in my purse for emergencies. I was floored at how intensely the feeling was. I'm grateful that I don't feel like this more often like I used to when I was younger, but it was still just as frightening as my very first one 30 years ago. It is hard to "float" like Clare Weekes recommends when you are dizzy from panic. Add in the thought that goes through your mind that you might pass out and make a fool of yourself in front of so many people.

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