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Sarno vs McGill

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Wilcox2969, May 27, 2019.

  1. Wilcox2969

    Wilcox2969 New Member

    I've had back pain for around 15 years now. I've had some success with the mind body approach, but not as much as I would like to have. So it has me always looking for other reasons for my back/knee/leg pains (mostly weakness/stiffness). Recently I came across a video by Stuart McGill where he was saying that with all of his experience he can always tell people where their pain is coming from before seeing their MRI, and once seen, their MRI just proves him to be correct. I know better than to believe this, because of all the studies that show people with severe spinal issues, but they don't have pain. But are there any REAL mechanical issues that cause pain that would somewhat vindicate people like McGill that are solely on the mechanical side of body pain? Or is he just really behind the times? One thing I have learned about the mind body crowd is that there isn't a lot of "body" in the mind body idea. This makes me think that sometimes the answer is in the middle, mind AND body, not just one or the other. If I was completely cured, I wouldn't be at this crossroads but it seems that I'm not the only one that has this issue judging by how many people only claim 70-80% cured. Let me know what you all think!
    Last edited: May 27, 2019
  2. zclesa

    zclesa Well known member

    Actually I had back pain and sciatica and my osteopath DID say which exact vertebrae would be causing my symptoms. And my MRI proved him correct. He knew it because he made me twist in certain ways and make certain postures and asked me when it hurt and if I had any other symptoms. However, I had actually injured myself and trapped a nerve - my foot went numb and that was more of a problem than the actual back pain. The back pain started getting milder with a few adjustments and some strengthening of my core muscles, and the pain completely resolved after only 5 sessions of osteopathy and has not recurred. That is how "normal" back injuries happen and heal.

    There is no mechanical reason why back pain would last for 15 years, according to Dr Sarno. Also back injuries do not cause pain as severe as TMS back pain. With a normal back injury, it starts healing and hurts less. The pain levels do not stay elevated. And it doesn't keep recurring either. Once it's healed, it's healed.
  3. birdsetfree

    birdsetfree Well known member

    I personally had therapy with Stuart Mc Gill for chronic back pain. I did everything he suggested but had no relief after six months. My MRI's had usually shown disc problems except for the last one I had after 15 years of pain. That one came back normal.

    Anyway it was only when I found Dr Sarno's TMS therapy that I freed myself from severe debilitating back pain. My success story is on here. I consider myself fully cured in that there is nothing wrong with my body, my mind is where the work still needs to be done. Tension generated from stubborn unhealthy mindsets and conditioning causes symptom imperatives to occasionally show up.

    My life has been transformed that's for sure and the pain pathways are becoming rusty as a new mind body confidence seeps in over time.
    grapefruit likes this.
  4. Wilcox2969

    Wilcox2969 New Member

    Hmm. What type of issues where you having? I'm so back and forth with this stuff.
  5. birdsetfree

    birdsetfree Well known member

    My main issue was back pain for 15 years. Surrounding that was a whole lot of stiffness, weakness and sciatic type pain down the legs and into the hips. I would also experience severe pressure on my back when standing or walking and could only sit for 1 minute due to severe lower back pain. I was diagnosed from the beginning with compromised discs but eventually had a negative MRI which convinced me the symptoms were due to TMS.

    What also helped me decide on the true nature of my pain was the realisation that I could affect it mentally at times. Accepting this and paying attention to it in order to build evidence spurred me on through recovery.
  6. Miriam G. Bongiovanni

    Miriam G. Bongiovanni Peer Supporter

    Remember that real physical abnormalities and pain sometimes go together and can still be treated using the TMS approach. According to Sarno, the mind knows how to pick the location of pain, and if there is a structural abnormality, it is more likely to pick an area close to that physical 'problem' and manifest the TMS pain there. For example, I had through an MRI I found a HAGL lesion in my shoulder (which means some kind of ligament was torn with no possibility of re attachiing). I was proposed surgery to fix it, but then I still eliminated pain completely using the TMS approach. The mind just chose that location to manifest pain because it was 'vulnerable'. The lesion is still there now (I didn't have surgery), but I can use my shoulder without any pain now (and use includes strenuous exercise like rock climbing ;-))

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