1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
    Dismiss Notice

Post-Triathlon TMS flare up?

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by JoyceVT, Sep 16, 2014.

  1. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Hello, I’m a classic TMSer and a driven type A marathon runner and now a triathlete. I haven't posted on here in a long time but anytime I had minor TMS flareups this summer this website helped me so much!

    I’ve been suffering from TMS with different symptoms for many years. For most of 2012-2014 I have been plagued with “shin splints” With the help of Dr Andrea Segal last January I made it to the Boston Marathon in 2014.

    This summer my husband and I trained very hard for our first half ironman triathlon (1.2 mile swim, 56 mile bike, 13.1 mile run) this past Sept 7, 2014. We both did very well and got through minor TMS flare ups mostly with my shin. I was even awarded the fastest female runner and 3rd amateur woman (and 1st in my age group 40-44). So I was thrilled with my results.

    However, a few hours later the back of my right knee flared up with pain and hurt to walk around. I didn’t worry too much because my coach wanted me to take the week off from training as a rest before starting my training back up for a marathon in early December. The pain behind my knee got better as the week went on and felt good enough to run yesterday. I had rested it a whole week and felt that should be fine. However after a 6 mile run, the pain came back a bit and was worse this morning.

    Is this TMS or could it be a legitimate injury after a big triathlon. Or could it be TMS taking advantage of a minor strain that got better after a week of rest? Right now it is sore to walk and I am supposed to run 8 miles today. Because this feels so scary I am going to try and swim later instead.

    What do you all think? Is this TMS? I look forward to your responses.


    Joyce Holsten

  2. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Congrats on your great achievement JVT, here's just one citation from a quick search at the other tms place, probably if you do a search here and there you will find reams on shin splints from a TMS perspective. I've done thirteen marathons and hundreds of other races, never had a shin-splint or a stress fracture, I think they're new dis-ease inventions. And don't forget the immortal words of Walt Stack, founder of the Dolphin South End Runners in frisco: "Don't you fast guys at the front forget it's us turkeys at the back that make you guys look good." And, "Start slow, and taper off."

    Posted - 07/11/2014 : 11:06:23
    Rearding SHIN SPLINTS from Steven Ray Ozanich's TMS book "THE GREAT PAIN DECEPTION":

    "Shin splints--Pounding feet on pavement is erroneously considered to be the cause of shin splints. The old wive's tale is that the muscle has pulled from the shin. Then somehow it miraculously reconnects again in a few days or weeks when the pain suddenly leaves. The foot hitting the pavement is merely the trigger for Phase 2 TMS. The inner self does not want to be running (demanding energy). Dr. Sarno called shinslints 'TMS Tendonitis'."

    From page 352, Apendix A: TMS Equivalents--Serving the Same Purpose as Pain

    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 30, 2014
  3. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Thanks Tennis Tom, I do believe 100% shin splints are TMS and that is how I got to the Boston marathon last year.

    But my concern is the soreness in the back of my right knee. I felt it a few hours after my first half ironman triathlon on 9-7-14 (a bit over a week ago). I let it rest and it felt better. I then went on a run yesterday and the back of my knee flared up again. Could this be TMS or a real injury/strain? It's tricky because this was right after a 5 hour and 6 minute race. But I trained properly all summer long without this type of problem.
  4. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    From a TMS perspective, if you did not experience trauma during the event, it could be TMS. Usually when you get injured you know it like spraining an ankle. In my running days, if I had an "injury" I would test it gingerly, if it went away in a few minutes like 20, I kept on trukin'. If it didn't I would walk and do RICE .

    Is there anything going on in your life emotionally from the TMS perspective, a la Rahe-Holmes? Perhaps you broke through your homeostasis, and your subconscious is rebelling at the sub-c thought of a marathon? A six mile training run is still a good chunk of real estate to the common man. Proceed gingerly, given your achievement no need to try breaking through an injury???TMS??? Be good to yourself with massages, mani-pedies, head-stands to reverse the weight of gravity on your muscles and sphincters, and lot's of rocky-road ice cream to simulate cross-country terrain. Proceed gingerly, listen to your mindbody. I can't be in your body--that would make your husband angry and he might run after me with a gun and I can't run anymore except in the pool. :arghh:
  5. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    I do have lots going on in my life that is perfect material for TMS. So having a flare up would be no surprise.
  6. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    And don't forget laughter therapy, watch comedies and musicals. In India they have laughing groups who just meet-up to LAUGH--some of them are laughing so hard they are being sued by the neighbors for disturbing the peace--I kid you not!
    JoyceVT likes this.
  7. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Joyce, I think it's great that you are doing those marathons and triathlons. You're giving yourself reasons to feel great about yourself.
    I would expect some soreness after such strenuous workouts. It may not be TMS or anything structural.
    I hope you're spending some time on TMS repressed emotions, too.
    JoyceVT likes this.
  8. ash86

    ash86 Peer Supporter

    Hi Joyce! I think its a pretty good indicator that your knee started to hurt a couple hours after the event was over. My guess is that you were distracted by the event, but after it all settled down, your mind began to distract you from some repressed emotions. You also didn't mention any serious injuries that occurred during the race.

    You stated that you and your husband trained very hard for the event. Maybe you were too hard on yourself during the training? Maybe that is why you felt fine until you started to train again.

    I think your best option is to acknowledge this is TMS and continue to train and be aware of how you "talk to yourself" during the training sessions. :)

    BTW Congrats on your accomplishment!
    JoyceVT and Tennis Tom like this.
  9. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Thanks for your thoughtful post ash86! It's true that I didn't feel any pain or injury while running. I do believe this is just more TMS. According to SteveO's book, I have stage 4 TMS which happens after a stressful event/accomplishment has been completed. With the big triathlon all over, my body was able to focus again of all my emotional stuff and start up the pain cylce as a distraction. According to Steve this is one of the most common forms of TMS. I used to get TMS symptoms (aka running injuries) the couple weeks before a marathon but I learned that it was TMS according to Monte.

    I swam yesterday and rode my bike into work today. I feel it doing both sports but running is the trigger. I will run tomorrow and try and work through this TMS. The biggest hurdle is getting over the fear of injuring myself worse.

    Walt - I have had typical soreness after big events and this feels more like a TMS flare up that disguises it's self as an overuse injury.
    ash86 likes this.
  10. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Joyce, it's great that you are swimming, biking, and even running despite some pain in running.
    Dr. Sarno is strong on assuring us we will not injure ourself or make ourself worse by resuming physical activity.
    Don't let fear swim, ride, or run with you. It's just part of the subconscious giving you TMS pain.
    Are you working on discovering your repressed emotions, past or present?
    JoyceVT likes this.
  11. ash86

    ash86 Peer Supporter

    That is great! With that mindset you will be over this bout in no time! Good luck. :)
    JoyceVT likes this.
  12. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Walt, I haven't run since Monday when my pain flared back up but will try tomorrow. I have been working on repressed emotions for a while. There are a ton! But I did fall off the wagon the last few months of training so it's time to get back to work and stay more on top of it.

    Thanks ash86. I do hope to get over this flare up quickly! :)
    ash86 likes this.
  13. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Just an update. Still really struggling with my TMS. January 2013 was the last time I had to take time off from running and cancel a marathon. But now it's happening again.

    The back of my right knee wasn't that bad trying to run but it was more sore afterward which was worrisome and I know I am not supposed to worry or feel fear. Yet it is sometimes impossible not to feel fear when you are a serious athlete. But I kept at it and didn't let the fear stop me from running. Early last week I developed a new TMS symptom: soreness/pain in my left hip/upper leg/groin area. It got worse as the week went on and I kept running on it. The back of my knee was still a little sore but the hip was much worse. (as of today my back of knee is 85% better and my hip is 10% better which is being optimistic)

    Last Friday I challenged my TMS and ran my 8 miler with 2 faster tempo miles at the end. It started out painful but then was tolerable (but still very sore) after a mile or so. I ran the first 6 miles easy and they were so uncomfortable and sore. Then I really challenged my TMS by sticking to my training plan and running the last two miles fast. And this was the best my hip felt! Of course afterward it was VERY sore!! And today it is still sore. I am afraid to run as running is only making it worse. I am going to cancel my marathon out in California this December and let things rest. This is so heart breaking!

    So frustrating that my TMS can still derail my training and marathon plans. Funny I've paid for 8 marathons in the last 4 years and have run 4 of them. The ones I didn't run were due to TMS. Wish I could just get "un stuck".....I know the hip is a symptom imperative but it is just too sore to resume activity at the moment.
  14. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    Have you talked with Monte Hueftle? :


    Monte Hueftle
    Monte says " I suffered with TMS for more than 20 years and have now been pain free for the past 8 years. My TMS consultation practice focuses on helping people reverse this pain disorder by learning their unique behaviors and thoughts and the way that they generated inner tension and repress their emotions. Many of Dr. Sarno's patients state that my information is the "missing link" that has helped them understand the psychological strategy of TMS." (Source)

    Works Primarily via Phone
    (818) 486-8525
    TMS Wiki Profile / Survey Response / Forum Posts / Videos / Website

    Main Wiki Page About Monte Hueftle

    Archive of Runningpain.com Updates


    Enrique said, "I'll throw in my 2 cents about Monte. At the end of 2009, I was battling some knee pains that I thought might be TMS because it was taking months to heal. I had stopped all running for many months. Reading the Master Practice and utilizing the "tools" in there helped. A talk on the phone and some email exchanges helped, too. I got back to running pretty quickly after that and the pain subsided within a week or two as I was ramping up my mileage! I learned a great deal about how TMS can come back after years of no pains and then how to get over it."

    LorieG said, "As you know I suffered from an acute back pain attack about 6 months ago and the pain seemed like it would never go away. Reading Dr. Sarno only, did not do the trick this time. I got help from reading the TMS Wiki, Monte and "The Power of Now." Meditating and thinking positively really helped. Suddenly I was on the mend. Well, I danced, a lot, at my daughter's wedding last weekend. I was in great shape. Only once did I feel a twinge of sciatica and I poopooed it away. Since this was a destination wedding we stayed for a whole week and also did some serious hiking. Again I was fine. I drove for two hours on the ride home and again talked my sciatica away. Thanks to everyone on the Wiki for sharing their experiences with me and helping me through bad times."
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2014
  15. JoyceVT

    JoyceVT Well known member

    Thanks Tennis Tom, I have Monte's books and have spoken to him several times over the years. I discovered him back in 2009. And I have even communicated with Enrique another fellow runner/triathlete. Sad thing is I know all of this stuff but I just can't seem to break through.
  16. Gigalos

    Gigalos Beloved Grand Eagle

    Okay, litte side track story. Don't know if it may help you at all or if it applies in any way to your situation.
    I give training to young table tennis players. There is one boy that doesn't want to leave after the training, he wants to watch the adults play and his mother has to struggle to get him home. He is pretty obsessed so to say. When I ask him if he shouldn't go home, he answers quite annoyed that it isn't fun at home. Is this good? Is this bad? I just don't know. When does an obsession become bad... and why do we develop obsessions? Is it to side track us from repressed emotions that are brewing? Is it because we want to prove ourselves something for some reason. Are we sometimes literally running away or towards something? I don't think there is a good answer to the question whether being obsessed with for example running is good or bad, because obsessed people play an important role in evolution of mankind.
    All I know is that I personally need to be aware to put 'having fun' on a prominent spot. Of course there is a strong link between playing successful and having fun, but when I play badly I can still have fun; when I play well though, there is no guarantee that I feel like I have fun... When I become too obsessed my TMS usually flares up and I have little fun doing it, or is it the other way, when my TMS flares up I become too obsessed with table tennis and have little fun doing it? All I know is that they are connected and that usually emotions are brewing in my body when obsessions become more prominent and the fun factor decreases.

    hmmm, I learned something writing that down.... obsession is a good TMS thermometer for me :)
    Ellen likes this.

Share This Page