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one or the other

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Markus, Jun 27, 2015.

  1. Markus

    Markus Guest

    I hope this goes here if not, please move it. I'm just wondering what you all think because I started doing the presence proces, and I've done one week and I realize that it's really too much. In fact on my Kindle I have yet to read the mind body prescription, Healing back pain, and the divided mind. On top of what I haven't read as far as what I call my TMS work or my mind body work I like the word mind/body a lot better, but I wanted to start either the SEP, or the other program that's available here on the wiki. I think I'll do the SEP. But I'm under the impression that doing the presence process along with the other stuff is too much, as my reason for coming here was chronic pain debilitating chronic pain. So I'm asking for opinions affirmations of my thought that I should stick to the work that involves mind body strictly until I'm Where I'm close to being healed, because I feel overwhelmed doing Michael Brown's book. So I'm sticking with the mind-body program any of you think I'm making the correct decision? It sounds like a silly question because everybody is going to say you know yourself better than everyone else, but I just wanted to ask to see if anyone has done both. Anyhow that's it Cheers,
    Grateful17 likes this.
  2. IndiMarshall

    IndiMarshall Well known member

    I haven't come across the presence process nor Micheal Brown book.

    I am doing Healing Back Pain and SEP. This suited me well.
    Every time I go back and read Psychology and Treatment chapters in Healing Back pain.
    Believe me you find a new observation which will take you some old or new repressed feeling and it sinks well.
    This is the reason many ppl just get cured by reading the book.

    What is the Health complaint ?
    End of the day. Everyone's journey to cure is different.
  3. Markus

    Markus Guest

    My health complaint? Originally termed Fibromyalgia,myofascial pain syndrome,

    Thanks...I believe you right! Michael B's book is helpful but it's more for emotional help.
  4. Forest

    Forest Beloved Grand Eagle

    Heya, Marcus,

    Just to start out with a disclosure, I'm not really a Presence Process type of guy because the PP seems a little on the "woooo-woo" and nonscientific side. With that said, I've known a bunch of people through this site who say that it was very helpful to them, and endorsements like that mean a lot to me. On the other hand, it sounds like Michael Brown, the author, might be selling some sort of weird supplement now (see this thread from our old site), which frankly turns me off a bit as it sounds like a scammy money-making scheme.

    With that said, different things seem to work for different people, and anything that gets rid of your pain is good in my book. Everyone is welcome to their own opinion... Different opinions are what keeps old timers interested in a forum like this, and the old-timers bring wisdom and a depth of experience that is just golden.

    In general, I think you want to focus on keeping it simple. Start with the SEP or just reading Healing Back Pain or The Mindbody Prescription. Try to keep your "TMS Work" down to about half an hour or an hour per day and just focus on living your life and really enjoying it. Be mindful of your systems and try to get to the point where you are completely detached from your symptoms and they almost don't matter to you at all.

    @Abigail 's recent blog post is a good summary of how to live beyond your symptoms, using them only as a signal:
    Markus likes this.
  5. IndiMarshall

    IndiMarshall Well known member

    Good luck Marcus. I think whatever combination of books and programmes we choose its all about realizing the repressed emotions. I wish you all the best. I think you should start reading Healing Back Pain sooner or later.
    Markus likes this.
  6. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Marcus, whatever works for you, go with it. If two programs at one time seems too much, drop one and go with the other.

    I think it's very important to spend 15 minutes or half an hour each day going back to the basics of Dr. Sarno's 12 Daily Reminders. Herbie did a terrific job of giving us his version of them:

    1. The pain is due to TMS. This is real pain or anxiety but its caused by subconscious tensions and triggers, stressors and traits to your reactions and fears and also when at boiling point your conscious tension can and does cause real pain too.
    2. The main reason for the pain is mild oxygen deprivation. This means that when you get in pain or in anxiety then the the blood is restricted from going to your lower back for instance. The blood being restricted causes oxygen deprivation which causes the pain - remember, where theirs no oxygen then there is pain in the body. Also, The pain stays because of fear and focus to physical organic symptoms and repressions.
    3. TMS is a harmless condition caused by my REPRESSED EMOTIONS so even though you think you can harm yourself from the years of pain you have felt and how you feel in general -- so far no reports have been heard from tms healing knowledge causing damage to anyone, it only helps.
    4. The principle emotion is your repressed ANGER -- this means under your consciousness lies something that happens automatically to everyone. Tmsers have repressions that are stored because of our personality traits,traumas, stressors, fears, strain, etc... When these stored repressions build and build then eventually they cause the brain to send pain into your body to keep you from having an emotional crises. The mind-body thinks its helping you.
    5. TMS exists to DISTRACT your attentions from the emotions, stressors, tensions and strains of your personality traits because if you can get distraction then you wont have to be in emotional turmoil. When you don't face and feel your emotions and they get repressed cause you didn't want to deal with something -- they are just adding up in this beaker, ready to pour over and create real pain and anxiety in your body.
    6. Since my body is perfectly normal, there is nothing to fear. So in reality when I fear the pain or anxiety I just cause myself undo strain and tension adding to the beaker of pain. If I fear then I feed the pain, If I fear Its impossible to recondition. Fear keeps the pain and anxiety alive in the body through focus.
    7. Therefore, physical activity is harmless.If I want to work against the pain I could but its better to lose some of the pain so when I start my life over I=t have to be in pain trying to heal cause facing the repressions and all the other activities that cause the pain and reversing my fear and focus to them then I can heal.
    8. I am resuming all normal physical activity. I don't fear moving anymore. I believe in my bodies ability to heal now. I can move how I want. I will not fear moving with a bent back anymore. I will also practice going out and acting normal again, not in fear of what pain might do to me.
    9. The pain is unimportant and powerless. Its only power is how its hidden -- its illusion, Its fear.
    10. I will keep my attention on the emotional issues. I will think about my emotions and feel my emotions throughout the day. I will not judge, criticize or fear my emotions. I will not run from my emotional issues but face everyone of them. I will feel my emotions fully and cry if I need to. Then I will release the emotion and get my mind and thoughts back to my life and living in the present, in flow.
    11. I am in control of all of this. This is how I recover.
    12. I will be thinking PSYCHOLOGICALLY AT ALL TIMES. This means I will keep my thoughts on psychological issues like happiness, fear and anger -- traits and triggers, conditioning and journaling. The science behind mind-body/tms healing, etc.... This way I will not feed my thoughts to the body -- that is a trick of tms. Tms will always try to get me to focus on the body caused by the pain until I break its show and flair. When I get my attention off psychical symptoms and on emotional issues and psychological issues then I will not feed the fear of the physical issues anymore thus making the tms of no effect. This will in return, give us the cure.
  7. Markus

    Markus Guest

    Thanks a bunch because I need to catch up on my TMS reading. Michael Brown's book is fine,but Forest, I got the same "this is too new-agey for me, granted their are some excellent ideas in there. But, I want to heal. Walt thanks for the input as well.
    Forest likes this.
  8. IrishSceptic

    IrishSceptic Podcast Visionary

    I don't know a lot about the PP either but Wayne Kampers is a fan. he used it in conjunction with Georgie Oldfields program to completely recover from sciatica. Really worth listening to him as he is a qualified medical doctor/psychiatrist and sought out some of the top specialists in the world. This is where I feel the greatest change will come from. Doctors tend not to listen to patients anymore (for good reason in a lot of instances as the internet has lead to an explosion of WOO) but will listen to their colleagues.

    IndiMarshall, Forest and Markus like this.
  9. IrishSceptic

    IrishSceptic Podcast Visionary

    Oh and the new names made me smile , Walt the 'Beloved Grand Eagle' ... fantastic!
  10. pshanahan

    pshanahan New Member

    Markus = David Pocock?!
  11. IndiMarshall

    IndiMarshall Well known member

    thanks so much for the video.glad to see the awareness in UK too.
    IrishSceptic likes this.

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