Misaligned jaw - can't stop the fear!

[hello_henman]

Hi folks,

I wonder if there's anyone out there who can help stem what I believe to be the root of my fear.

As a bit of context, I've been pretty deep into the TMS world/research for a few years now. I've done all the required reading (and more), and the SEP. In that time I've seen some quite amazing things - pains that I've had in other parts of my body have disappeared (and come back), moved around, and generally behaved in such a way that I totally believe I have TMS.

The problem is that the place where all my problems started - my jaw - hasn't changed much, and I think that fear is a huge part of it. Basically, in the early days of my pain (I suffered a severe injury to my jaw playing hockey) I read a load of information online about how having a crooked jaw or misaligned bite can lead to a whole host of issues in the body, such a stiff/twisted neck, a twisted spine, sacroiliac joint issues etc. I had all those issues already, so what I was reading made perfect sense, and terrified the life out of me.

My bite is totally off - it contacts on the left side first and then slides over the the right - and I know I have a TMJ without reduction (basically a permanently misplaced TMJ disk) on one side. I also have severe pain when chewing on one side. This pain can vary slightly - there are some days where its a 5 out of 10 rather than a 9 - but basically it is always there.

What I'm really hoping is that there's someone on this forum, or someone who has a friend or relative, who has a seriously misaligned bite, molars that don't touch, etc but no pain or muscular issues to speak of. This would really help me get over that final hurdle and truly believe that my jaw isn't causing all my other issues. I'm stuck in this terrible loop where I bite down, feel my jaw shift, and remember all those posts about how an unstable jaw causes problems all over the body. The stress and fear is so strong. I do believe intellectually that the brain can be causing all these symptoms, rather than anything structural, but I don't believe it in my heart yet and I'm not sure anything will change until I do.

Can anyone help at all?

Thanks so much.

P.S. I've had a load of orthodontic work, it hasn't fully corrected the bite and I also tried a splint for a long time, which did nothing.

 

[Diana-M]

This isn’t the same exactly, but I sometimes jut my lower jaw out. After I learned about TMS, I noticed I do it when I’m mad, threatened or annoyed by someone. Kind of like I’m pushing them away with my jaw. As soon as I figure who or what I’m pushing away, and why. I stop the jutting. I know your situation is much worse. But maybe you could try asking your jaw what it’s mad about? It might take a lot of journaling. Keep digging. Just an idea?!

 

[Diana-M]

Here’s a thread about journaling on a symptom that might help. https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/threads/journaling-technique-what-is-your-tms-telling-you.15087/ (Journaling Technique: What is your TMS telling you?)

Here’s when I tried out this technique on my symptoms. https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/threads/tried-a-new-way-of-journaling-it%E2%80%99s-good.28333/ (Tried a new way of journaling: it’s good!)

 

[Cactusflower]

People who have “misaligned jaws” and no pain probably don’t know they have what you describe because they have never had to look into it. They are not obsessed about it like you are.
I will say I had phantom tooth pain for years. When I found out about TMS and explained to my dentist, he learned about it. Since then he has taken several courses (there was a dental conference in my city last year about it) and it has been found that TMJ is TMS. Coincidentally, when I explained the phantom tooth pain to my dentist it went away.
Consider that your anxiety, the inner stress you generate and the thoughts and beliefs you have may be reflected in your physical tension creating a myriad of symptoms. My thought is that you are still needing to do some more work. Your post show you are clearly still obsessed and anxious, asking only to speak to a specific set of people about very specific symptoms and that has TMS written all over it. You are Dr. Googling and feeding your TMS.
And anxiety. Have you gotten frustrated (inner anger), and perhaps disappointed that these symptoms have not subsided on the timeline you want them to disappear on? That is a lot of self-pressure.
Fear will fuel any symptom and fear goes beyond your symptoms.
I’m thinking about people who were born with little jaw yet have no body pain, folks who lost jaw due to oral cancer (I know a few) but have no body pain..

 

[Diana-M]

Have you gotten frustrated (inner anger), and perhaps disappointed that these symptoms have not subsided on the timeline you want them to disappear on? That is a lot of self-pressure.

I noticed that now in my 4th month on the wiki I’m just barely starting to not care about how long my TMS lasts. And that’s amazing, I was frantic when I first came in here. I secretly got mad at the gurus who said to relax and wait. How could I!!!!!!??? I didn’t get it. Now things are different, and my symptoms are subsiding just the tiniest bit. Very tiny. But I notice it. And I believe it’s because I’ve worked really hard at journaling out my anger, figuring out what/who is in my life hurting me (and getting rid of it/them), and stopping my abusive head talk. Every day I ask myself, “Would I like to spend time with me? Am I nice to be with?” If I say no, I try to fix that. Because I am the biggest influence on myself. My head is talking non-stop. It can be good for me or bad for me. I decide.

 

[hello_henman]

I noticed that now in my 4th month on the wiki I’m just barely starting to not care about how long my TMS lasts. At that’s amazing. I was frantic when I first came in here. I secretly go mad at the gurus who said to relax and wait. How could I!!!!!!??? I didn’t get it. Now things are different, and my symptoms are subsiding just the tiniest bit. Very tiny. But I notice it. And I believe it’s because I’ve worked really hard at journaling out my anger, figuring out what/who is in my life hurting me (and getting rid of it/them), and stopping my abusive head talk. Every day I ask myself, “Would I like to spend time with me? Am I nice to be with?” If I say no, I try to fix that. Because I am the biggest influence on myself. My head is talking non-stop. It can be good for me or bad for me. I decide.

Thank you very much for the kind messages. I've definitely had days, weeks even, where I don't really care too much about how long TMS lasts, and I can get myself into a place of believing (almost entirely) that everything will be fine. But it's hard. The fear comes back and it's so ingrained.

'll try your method of journaling too. I did plenty when I first joined the forum and read Sarno's books. I definitely had a lot of trauma when I was younger and am definitely a massive over-thinker. I think the over-thinking is more my problem these days, rather than any repressed anger. Its what keeps me scared and stuck in a problem-solving mode. Very hard to let go of! I probably do need to keep digging though, really work out what's bothering me deep down and try to relax. It might be the pressure around having kids to be honest. My girlfriend and I are going to start trying soon (a massive decision but one I said I needed to stop avoiding in order to try and 'live normally'.) Perhaps that's part of what's going on on a deep psychological level.

 

[hello_henman]

People who have “misaligned jaws” and no pain probably don’t know they have what you describe because they have never had to look into it. They are not obsessed about it like you are.
I will say I had phantom tooth pain for years. When I found out about TMS and explained to my dentist, he learned about it. Since then he has taken several courses (there was a dental conference in my city last year about it) and it has been found that TMJ is TMS. Coincidentally, when I explained the phantom tooth pain to my dentist it went away.
Consider that your anxiety, the inner stress you generate and the thoughts and beliefs you have may be reflected in your physical tension creating a myriad of symptoms. My thought is that you are still needing to do some more work. Your post show you are clearly still obsessed and anxious, asking only to speak to a specific set of people about very specific symptoms and that has TMS written all over it. You are Dr. Googling and feeding your TMS.
And anxiety. Have you gotten frustrated (inner anger), and perhaps disappointed that these symptoms have not subsided on the timeline you want them to disappear on? That is a lot of self-pressure.
Fear will fuel any symptom and fear goes beyond your symptoms.
I’m thinking about people who were born with little jaw yet have no body pain, folks who lost jaw due to oral cancer (I know a few) but have no body pain..

Thanks Cactus, appreciate you taking the time to respond. You are of course totally right than I'm obsessed with it. I'm a chronic overthinker - had that long before I ever had any physical issues. I just have that nagging feeling that if I could find one person whose bite is badly misaligned like mine, who doesn't have any issues, that would be the 'evidence' I need to let my brain finally relax. I've been close to relaxing before - I know a lot of people say TMJ pain isn't related to structural issues but these people all seem to have clicking and popping when their jaws open (which I know is relatively normal) but normal disk locations on closing. Ie their jaws aren't subluxated at rest. My problem is that the disks are out of whack when the jaw is closed and as such my jaw sits at a wonky angle and the muscles seem to be permanently tight.

I know I'm obsessing. I know I'm overthinking, but I just can't get around it at the moment. My brain is desperate for some evidence of someone who has something similar, but no issues. I hear what you're saying about people with no lower jaws (poor souls) but that is a slightly different kettle of fish in terms of muscle imbalance from side to side. Oh, what I wouldn't give to just switch the fearful part of my brain off!!! Anyway - I'm very glad your phantom tooth pain went away. If you ever get the chance to ask your dentist whether they've seen asymptomatic patients with TMJ disks without reduction on one side please let me know! Your dentist sounds very enlightened

 

[Cactusflower]

"My problem is that the disks are out of whack when the jaw is closed and as such my jaw sits at a wonky angle and the muscles seem to be permanently tight."

Of COURSE they are... you suggested you are obsessing, overthinking and STRESSING about it. I'm pretty sure this is probably not the only part of life you stress. You are also totally TMS-ing that your case must be different than any other person who has pain. No, I am not going to ask my dentist about your pain, that's just totally so obsessive - why on earth would I ask my dentist about some stranger's symptoms on an internet forum. Your brain is just really swirling and whirling and anxious. This is 100% anxiety.
Claire Weekes is your anxiety friend. Her book Hope and Help for your nerves gives exact and precise directions on how to deal with anxious thoughts. Thoughts are just thoughts they are not truths.
Symptoms and anxiety just don't magically switch off, you need to do the work. You can read every book and look at every program, but there is a level of being totally and brutally honest and vulnerable with yourself that it takes to heal (on top of knowledge).

You've done a wonderful job with healing other TMS symptoms...and sometimes when there is more work to be done those old symptoms really don't quite leave - they move around to places where your brain KNOWS it's got your attention. It has you believing that some teensy little discs in your jaw are wreaking havoc on your entire body. It is controlling your thoughts. Why are you letting it? Honestly, that's the simple truth of it. Your brain is not the commander of your thoughts...YOU are (and that's pretty awesome). It's about education, and choosing what and how you are going to believe.

"but I just can't get around it at the moment"

The best thing about that phrase is "at the moment". Why "can't" you? It is certainly not impossible, and you've actually proven it IS possible in the past!

When you did the "work" to heal in the past, did you work with your anxiety, your thoughts, emotions, beliefs?

 

[Diana-M]

Symptoms and anxiety just don't magically switch off, you need to do the work. You can read every book and look at every program, but there is a level of being totally and brutally honest and vulnerable with yourself that it takes to heal (on top of knowledge).

Quotable!

 

[Cactusflower]

This podcast may help you!
Scroll to episode S2E27 of the Curiosity Cure and keep listening because Dani will get to chronic overthinking and explain what needs to be done to curb the habit. It’s just a habit that can change over time by finding a way to disconnect from the mind by connecting with your body.

 

[JanAtheCPA]

I just have that nagging feeling that if I could find one person whose bite is badly misaligned like mine, who doesn't have any issues, that would be the 'evidence' I need to let my brain finally relax.

Hey there hello_henman. I can't add anything to the good advice you've received, but I can assure you that even if you found this magical person, your tricksy TMS brain would find juuuust enough of a discrepancy between your symptoms and their symptoms to create continued doubt, and bingo - it has you right back where it wants you, which is exactly where you are today.

You can choose to call bullshit on this process and take charge. You know what to do!

 

[Baseball65]

Hey there hello_henman. I can't add anything to the good advice you've received, but I can assure you that even if you found this magical person, your tricksy TMS brain would find juuuust enough of a discrepancy between your symptoms and their symptoms to create continued doubt, and bingo - it has you right back where it wants you, which is exactly where you are today.

You can choose to call bullshit on this process and take charge. You know what to do!

Yep. I have a Jaw like a pitbull terrier and just as F'd up teeth (and some missing ones from obsessing and 'fixing' them)..I didn't comment, because of the obsessional component. When i was having fake Teeth issues, it was about the bad relationships in my life. The three lettered scapegoats were just some shiny objects to stare at to keep me from feeling the pain of being rejected, abandoned, etc.
Since No one else was having my personal problems, no one else's symptom ID would suffice...

 

[Ralph99]

Hi folks,

I wonder if there's anyone out there who can help stem what I believe to be the root of my fear.

As a bit of context, I've been pretty deep into the TMS world/research for a few years now. I've done all the required reading (and more), and the SEP. In that time I've seen some quite amazing things - pains that I've had in other parts of my body have disappeared (and come back), moved around, and generally behaved in such a way that I totally believe I have TMS.

The problem is that the place where all my problems started - my jaw - hasn't changed much, and I think that fear is a huge part of it. Basically, in the early days of my pain (I suffered a severe injury to my jaw playing hockey) I read a load of information online about how having a crooked jaw or misaligned bite can lead to a whole host of issues in the body, such a stiff/twisted neck, a twisted spine, sacroiliac joint issues etc. I had all those issues already, so what I was reading made perfect sense, and terrified the life out of me.

My bite is totally off - it contacts on the left side first and then slides over the the right - and I know I have a TMJ without reduction (basically a permanently misplaced TMJ disk) on one side. I also have severe pain when chewing on one side. This pain can vary slightly - there are some days where its a 5 out of 10 rather than a 9 - but basically it is always there.

What I'm really hoping is that there's someone on this forum, or someone who has a friend or relative, who has a seriously misaligned bite, molars that don't touch, etc but no pain or muscular issues to speak of. This would really help me get over that final hurdle and truly believe that my jaw isn't causing all my other issues. I'm stuck in this terrible loop where I bite down, feel my jaw shift, and remember all those posts about how an unstable jaw causes problems all over the body. The stress and fear is so strong. I do believe intellectually that the brain can be causing all these symptoms, rather than anything structural, but I don't believe it in my heart yet and I'm not sure anything will change until I do.

Can anyone help at all?

Thanks so much.

P.S. I've had a load of orthodontic work, it hasn't fully corrected the bite and I also tried a splint for a long time, which did nothing.

I am fairly certain all of your issues are TMS. I have pain also when I bite at a certain angle on my lower right molars. I went to a dentist and they said one of the teeth is cracked, but I get pain from 2 different teeth. She also said I have other cracked teeth, but I have no pain from them. We could not reproduce the pain with the bite stick. My dentist said I grind my teeth and I have a misaligned bite. I think they tell 70% of their patients they have cracked teeth, grinding, and bite issues. I am certain the trigeminal nerve in my neck is irritated from stress (which incidentally, happened to John Sarno, who also described tooth pain in one of his books). I probably have some level of TMJ from tensing my jaw. Both of these are not structural issues or nerve impingement, because I have had no accidents or injuries to my neck or head in my life. Even if I had, I would still be certain it is TMS. I think I clench heavily on the right side at night when I am dreaming, which probably makes the muscles and nerves more tense. I notice I carry tension in my jaw during the day. But it is not an injury or misaligned jaw causing it. It is stress/tension. Because you believe you have a misaligned jaw, the TMS monster has you by the you know what. It knows you will not believe it is anything other than your jaw. When I thought my teeth were broken, it was way worse for me also. It was the ultimate distraction. My brain had me by the you know what. I can report back that my pain has not gotten worse, but it hasn't gone away yet. I will let you know if it does.