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Living without Love

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Boston Redsox, Jun 29, 2015.

  1. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    Help me answer this question tms family.

    As u all know or not....I am living with with my wife who wants a divorce but I will not give her alimony and support her she is health women who can work.

    Also I can not afford to move out and support my kids and take care of myself. I know this whole situation with my unfaithful wife as brought me to my tms condition.

    Is it possible for me to find forgiveness in my heart and continue with my tms healing . what I am asking is it possible to over come these living arrangements issues. ( We are getting along without issue) she does her own thing and I do mine.

    Any guidance would be helpful

  2. Zumbafan

    Zumbafan Well known member

    Yes, it is possible to forgive your wife. You have the power to make that choice. You could ask yourself what good will it do me if I hold a grudge? You only hurt yourself. I hope I don't sound flippant, as I have had to make decisions about forgiveness, just wanted to encourage you that it can be done.
    Kathleen likes this.
  3. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    Thx for your honest opinion I feel it would be a great accomplishment if I could truly forgive and and remove this rage from me .
  4. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    Marco, forgiving is great because it sets us emotionally free. Holding in anger and emotional hurt only creates pain.

    I've found that a good way to forgive is to ask the Lord to bring peace to the person who hurt us, and to ourselves.

    We may be able to forgive, but not forget. The passage of time helps us to forget.

    Here are some thoughts on forgiving that may be helpful. They are from Andrea Brandt, PhD, in an article in 2014
    from Psychology Today:

    Whether it's a spouse who was unfaithful, a parent who let you down as a child, or a friend who shared something told in confidence, we all must face the question of whether and how to forgive.

    After you are wronged and the initial wave of emotion has passed, you're presented with a new challenge: Do you forgive the person? By forgiving, you let go of your grievances and judgments and allow yourself to heal. While this may sound good in theory, in practice forgiveness can sometimes feel impossible.

    To learn how to forgive, you must first learn what forgiveness is not. Most of us hold at least some misconceptions about forgiveness. Here are some things that forgiving someone doesn't mean:

    • Forgiveness doesn't mean you are pardoning or excusing the other person's actions.
    • Forgiveness doesn't mean you need to tell the person that he or she is forgiven.
    • Forgiveness doesn't mean you shouldn't have any more feelings about the situation.
    • Forgiveness doesn't mean there is nothing further to work out in the relationship or that everything is okay now.
    • Forgiveness doesn't mean you should forget the incident ever happened.
    • Forgiveness doesn't mean you have to continue to include the person in your life.
    • ... and forgiveness isn't something you do for the other person.
    By forgiving, you are accepting the reality of what happened and finding a way to live in a state of resolution with it. This can be a gradual process—and it doesn't necessarily have to include the person you are forgiving. Forgiveness isn't something you do for the person who wronged you; it's something you do for you.

    So if forgiveness is something you do for yourself and if it can help you heal, why is it so hard?

    There are several reasons: You're filled with thoughts of retribution or revenge; you enjoy feeling superior; you don't know how to resolve the situation; you're addicted to the adrenaline that anger provides; you self-identify as a "victim"; or you're afraid that by forgiving you have to re-connect—or lose your connection—with the other person. These reasons not to forgive can be resolved by becoming more familiar with yourself, with your thoughts and feelings, and with your boundaries and needs.

    Now that you know what forgiveness is not and why it's so hard to do, ask yourself: Do I want to forgive?

    Forgiveness requires feeling willing to forgive. Sometimes you won't, because the hurt went too deep, or because the person was too abusive, or expressed no regret. Do not attempt to forgive someone before you have identified, fully felt, expressed, and released your anger and pain.

    If you decide you are willing to forgive, find a good place and time to be alone with your thoughts. Then, try following these four steps to forgive even when it feels impossible:

    1. Think about the incident that angered you. Accept that it happened. Accept how you felt about it and how it made you react. In order to forgive, you need to acknowledge the reality of what occurred and how you were affected.
    2. Acknowledge the growth you experienced as a result of what happened. What did it make you learn about yourself, or about your needs and boundaries? Not only did you survive the incident, perhaps you grew from it.
    3. Now think about the other person. He or she is flawed because all human beings are flawed. He or she acted from limited beliefs and a skewed frame of reference because sometimes we all act from our limited beliefs and skewed frames of reference. When you were hurt, the other person was trying to have a need met. What do you think this need was and why did the person go about it in such a hurtful way?
    4. Finally, decide whether or not you want to tell the other person that you have forgiven him or her. If you decide not to express forgiveness directly, then do it on your own. Say the words, "I forgive you," aloud and then add as much explanation as you feel is merited.
    Forgiveness puts the final seal on what happened that hurt you. You will still remember what happened, but you will no longer be bound by it. Having worked through the feelings and learned what you need to do to strengthen your boundaries or get your needs met, you are better able to take care of yourself in the future. Forgiving the other person is a wonderful way to honor yourself. It affirms to the universe that you deserve to be happy.
    Xara, paingoaway and Kathleen like this.
  5. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    Walt thx so much for this outline on forgiveness.... It as help clear up a few things
  6. Anne Walker

    Anne Walker Beloved Grand Eagle

    Hi. I am trying to understand a little more clearly. Does your wife definitely want a divorce? Is she still seeing the person she had the affair with? Would she consider working on rebuilding her marriage with you? If the answer is yes, I think it is essential that you get the guidance of a really good marriage therapist who can help you slowly rebuild trust and address some of the conflicts that may have led to the affair to begin with. It is completely possible for a marriage to survive infidelity and to come back with time and hard work, stronger than ever. It is not easy and both partners must want it and be committed to the process. If, on the other hand, your wife wants to end your marriage and the two of you are stuck together for financial reasons than that is very difficult. I would get the advise of a good attorney who specializes in mediation. I made the decision and committed to mediation when I was divorced from my first husband after a 17 year long marriage. It was tough because I had supported him for over 10 years. Texas is a community property state and so we had to split all of our assets. Basically, I had to give him half of everything I head earned over 20 years when he had not done very much and had several affairs(and he was the one ending the marriage because he had "accidentally" fallen in love with a much younger waitress). It was a tough pill to swallow but we had young children and I think emotionally the mediation process was much better and in the end fair. Our mediated divorce cost about $40,000. I have a friend who was in a vicious divorce which involved a custody battle and it cost over $600,000! Financial costs aside, when you hire lawyers with the sole purpose of going after each other, they do a really good job, make a lot of money, and everyone looses. This is just my personal opinion, but if your wife truly is not willing to consider working on your marriage, eventually you need to find a way to separate and move on, whether you can afford it or not. I cannot think of a couple that could successfully live long term under such an arrangement. I could be wrong. I lost so much in my divorce. But in the aftermath, I was able to rebuild, change my career, meet a wonderful man, recover from TMS, and after all of that... I am whole and happier than I have ever been. I work very hard, I am poorer than I have ever been, and yet I would not change a thing. I can only say this in retrospect though.
    Kathleen, Ellen and Mala like this.
  7. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member


    Thx so much for your advice…. after our first meeting with the mediator I left there with my mouth open. Child support which I have no problem with, splitting all assets had no problem with, but I refuse to pay her alimony for 17 years till I am 68. I told her it was off the table I told her I would help her with learning a skill or whatever it would take for her to earn a living I even said I would keep her on my Ins Policy. But she did not agree so we are at cross roads.

    I will not give her alimony she is a healthy intelligent women who can work. I mean come on after numerous affairs and carry on with a man from out of state she wants me to support her out of the question. she is going to walk away with a lot of money that she did not earn. Am I wrong.
    Kathleen likes this.
  8. Anne Walker

    Anne Walker Beloved Grand Eagle

    No, I don't think you are wrong. 17 years is a long time! I know when we worked with our mediation lawyers, they both had a very good idea what would probably happen in court based on the law. For instance, we were going to have to split our assets. I am not sure where the law stands in your state when it comes to alimony.
    Divorce is very painful and there are many conflicting and intense emotions. I think I would give the mediators more of a chance to work things out. Just because she doesn't agree in the first meeting doesn't mean that's it, does it? How did the mediators suggest you proceed?
  9. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    Well she basically said it's the law and ingrained it in her head so that's the stand still also she told me that she did not want to work. I refuse to be a financial prisoner to her. She said it would not be for long but I told her I would help her without putting this on paper . She said no . So the divorce she wanted so bad is at a stand still.
  10. Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021)

    Walt Oleksy (RIP 2021) Beloved Grand Eagle

    My best friend had an affair with his secretary and his wife beat him up and then divorced him.
    Within a year they reconciled and are back together again, the past forgiven and forgotten.
    Or at least forgiven, if not forgotten.

    It may not be easy, but reconciliation after someone has cheated can bring loved ones back together.
  11. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    I feel the same way but I guess it has to be a 2 way street I don't think she as it in her to express those feeling even if she wanted 2 in would work at it but I feel I would be alone in this pursuit.
  12. Mala

    Mala Well known member

    Marco forgive me if I say anything inappropriate but its just that there is very little information to go on considering the enormity of what u r yr wife have been, are & will go thru.

    So far from what I have read the gist is:

    Your wife has cheated on u many times.

    She wants a divorce.

    You refuse to give her any alimony for.

    You r living together because of financial reasons.

    You want to be able to forgive her.

    You consider getting back together as a possibility even though she's made it clear that she doesn't.

    The way I see it is that there is no resolution to anything at the moment either emotionally or physically since u r both kind stuck together. She seems to know her own mind whereas u r still trying to digest the situation & make some sense out of it. Isn't that the worse possible situation to be in as there is no going forward for either of you? I totally agree with Anne that very few ppl could find happiness or forgiveness living in this sort of environment. How long can you both live yr lives on hold like this?

    Having said all that i do wish u all the best.

    Last edited: Jul 2, 2015
    Ellen likes this.
  13. sam908

    sam908 Peer Supporter

    What's with the u, r, ppl, yr, etc.?
  14. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

  15. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    You are right Mala at the moment I am at a stand still with this....but I will say that by living together and forgiving her and I also apologized for my issues I have been able to grow more emotionally.

    Until she finds a way to support her self


    Even though I agree with about moving on and we are kind of stuck until the time she decides to get a job and move on I am not going to support her.

    Regarding growing mentally and dealing with tms if anything it as help me faced emotions and say things to her that I would have not if we werent under the same roof.

    I told her I have forgiven her for her past and also I apologized for mine. She take that anyway she wants but I needed to tell her.

    At the moment this is my life I will not push it away I am going to let the universe deal with this . I wake everyday say thx you for the sunshine and go about the day. Whether she is her or not I will not let it affect me emotionally.

    Again thx so much for your honest thoughts. PS love the book you told me about. You are the placebo
    Kathleen likes this.
  16. Mala

    Mala Well known member

    Marco good to hear u being so positive about the whole situation & of course u must deal with things the way u see fit according to your own unique situation.

    Glad u liked the book. There are a lot of articles & videos about Joe Dispenza
    which I find very interesting & informative.

  17. Boston Redsox

    Boston Redsox Well Known Member

    I will watch those videos . when I get a chance.

    On ward and upwards.
    Markus likes this.

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