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Help! Bone bruising on knee and osteoarthritis

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by PMOoz, Oct 24, 2012.

  1. PMOoz

    PMOoz New Member

    I am a first time poster. I am 42 and was introduced to Sarno's concepts over 10 years ago. I fit the personality profile to a 'T' and realise now that my shin splints, planter fascitus, ITB pain that I endured during my early basketball career was all TMS. I had crippling back pain for months when my mother was diagnosed with cancer and neck pain that flares up when I am stressed. I stopped my osteopath and massage therapy and re-read the books or go to counselling when the pain lasts for longer than a couple of weeks.

    My question is this. Last April I tore my ACL in my left knee and had a huge bucket handle tear in my meniscus. They removed a large portion of my meniscus and repaired my knee ligament. I was told I could not run again because of lack of cartilage otherwise I would be looking at a knee replacement before I was 50. My rehab has been very slow and I have really struggled with not being able to exercise.
    Eights months into my rehab when I started to attempt squats when my right knee started to swell and become very painful. An MRI revealed severe osteoarthritis and a bone bruise. I have a fabulous physician who said surgery is not effective and to just go back to basics, bike with less intensity and take it really easy. Maybe down the trck we could look at steroid injection or a lubricant injection for the joint.

    Last night I picked up one of Sarno's books and the light went off! My husband has decided to quit his very well paid, family friendly job because he does not feel challenged. He has no job to go to but is not worried. We have a massive mortgage and I start back at work in a few months and I realise I am furious because I think he is selfish to quit this great job. Is this the source of my knee pain?? It usually manifests in my neck.

    Do I ignore the warning of the surgeon and just run, exercise through the pain because it's TMS?

    What about the bone bruising?

    The physician told me that he had a young athlete with less cartilage than me who returned to running and that they just don't know enough about how knees react to training. Thinking back this is a major clue that it should not cause pain. He also said that the injections work for some and not others. I also found a youtube presentation from a surgeon who said that 42% of all patella femoral arthritis patients have psychiatric problems!! This all seems to make sense to me.

    Any feedback would be welcomed! I cannot seem to find any information on bone bruising and would love to hear from others (40+) who were told not to run because of osteo -arthritis of the knee but are now successfully running.

    Thank you!
  2. Steve Ozanich

    Steve Ozanich TMS Consultant

    Hi someone,

    No one here can or should tell you to ignore your surgeon's advice, not even an MD. That's a personal choice you must make, armed with the knowledge of TMS. But also with the knowledge that many of us ignored our doctor's warnings, and healed. But our lives are in our own hands, we took that leap of faith and it paid off.

    You certainly can hurt yourself, and it hurts for a reason, and it takes time to heal, but it will heal. I would be suspicious of ominous words like bone bruising and AO. But this doctor sounds like he knows what he's doing, somewhat, but only knows part of the truth. I've seen several who were warned not to run, but who ran and were ok. You are as strong as you think you are, no doctor can tell you how to live your life, and no doctor has the ability to forecast your future. They're basing their statements on beta information.

    Your TMS-equivalents sends up big red flares and red TMS flags and horns honking. Plus you have the timing of your husband's job loss. These all appear to point to TMS, especially if your pain jumped from right to left knee, the SI in nefarious action. But only an MD can make the TMS diagnosis. The rest is up to you armed with some knowledge, lots of common sense, and a bit of faith.

    If you look at the Baylor College 2002 RA knee study it's clear that AO surgery is a placebo, and some rheumatologists agreed after they saw the results. The steroids and the lubricants are also placebos and only work if you believe they do. That's why they work for some and not others, like chiro and acu, and most other medical modalities.

    Your surgeon appears to be ok, but he doesn't know the full story because its just now emerging. Surgery many times results in a placebo reaction; if it pleased the person, then it works. If you get cleared to move forward from your doctors, look into this TMS healing. You certainly sound like you have it, but it's nebulous/sneaky in that it can overlay itself onto real injuries. I would look at your healing time too. Wounds heal in good time, they don't linger for months.

    Good luck, if you get time Saturday come by the webinar, I hear it's gonna be a real shindig.

  3. honeybear424

    honeybear424 Well known member

    I marked it on my calendar last week, Steve!
  4. PMOoz

    PMOoz New Member

    Thank you so much for the feedback Steve! I realise that I have to be fully convinced that it is not structural so I can start to get through the process.

    I still have lingering doubts about the bone bruising as TMS. According to my physician he said he could not believe I had been working out with the injury as it is very painful. It is when there is very little cartilage and the bone starts to rub. I had been favouring my right knee when I squatted because my left knee hurt so much. I also generally favoured my right knee for over a year because of surgery. I found some studies that said bone brusing can take months to heal and that it consistent with what my Dr told me. I am very confused where the real injury stops and the TMS begins!!!

    I am also confused about arthritis. I have found many studies about OA in the knee, it's causes and the subsequent reasons for knee replacements.

    Are they all TMS?

    Can a person have real pain from severe OA that requires a knee replacement?

    Of course companies make huge profits from these devices so the research will always support these findings!!

    Do you know of anyone who has had a total knee replacement whose pain continued, which would lead me to believe it was TMS?

    Interestingly in the past few days the pain intensity has come and gone but is always there and after doing some TMS work last night ( journalling) I woke up with my usual stiff neck which is an indication of severe stress but my knee felt better!! So it is moving around. Classic TMS.

    I can accept it's mostly TMS but I need some more information before I can begin to run again. I need someone to tell me that they have hardly any cartilage but run anyway and have no pain!!

  5. ragis45

    ragis45 New Member

    I know this post is a bit late but I only recently found this wiki.
    Please check out this site http://www.brachy-myotherapie.com/english/joint-pain-and-osteoarthritis/
    The proponents of this therapy make a very strong case as to why most OA is muscular in nature. I think they've got the cause of the pain right....I just don't think they have the reason for the pain correct (TMS vs. trauma). This site was a HUGE eye opener for me as I struggle with knee swelling and pain.
  6. PMOoz

    PMOoz New Member

    Thank you for that link!

    I have since had a great conversation with an amazing sports' physician who said the same thing. OA is so variable in so many people and there is no correlation between presentation of OA on an MRI and pain. As in back pain, the same is for knees.

    FYI with respect to a bone bruise, it is an structural in nature. This doctor said that if you had 100 people with the same MRI that I had, every single person would be in significant pain. The actual scientific name alludes me at the moment but he assured me that the pain pathways for bone bruising is akin to a severe ankle sprain in so far as that everyone who experiences an ankle sprain will experience pain during the acute phase. Once it has healed after about 4-6 weeks though you should be able to resume normal activities without pain. That was true for me. The pain I experienced from bone bruising was completely different to the OA pain I had on my knee cap. The OA pain came and went and mived around while the bone bruising pain was in the same spot, was constant and gradually faded over time as I eased up on my activities.

    Hope your knees feel as good as mine now! As for my kneck.... I am working on that.



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