1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
    Dismiss Notice

Facing surgery...confused

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by momoftwins, Oct 25, 2016.

  1. momoftwins

    momoftwins Newcomer

    Throughout this process I have had contact with an orthopaedic surgeon. He is amazing and is a believer in TMS. I brought him onboard my recovery mainly to review my scans and make sure that there was nothing serious going on. While I have a large herniation, from day 1 he has recommended that I NOT have surgery and continue my mind body approach to healing (surgeons in Canada rarely push spinal surgery)

    However...yesterday I ended up in the ER because my pain was so bad and I couldn't move my leg (drop foot). Based on my worsening neurological symptoms he said that I am one of the very few who actually needs surgery, in order to save the nerve.

    This is all very confusing...if Dr Sarno claims that all abnormalities of the spine are harmless, how could there be any percentage of the population, no matter how small, that actually need surgery?

    Looking for some clarity in this situation, if anyone has any thoughts or similar experiences I would love to hear about it.
  2. Steve Ozanich

    Steve Ozanich TMS Consultant

    There’s a lot said here that needs clarified some, I’ll try. But the ultimate decision is yours.

    Dr. Sarno never said that no abnormalities of the spine ever cause pain. That blanket covers too much. But it’s so rare that it’s unlikely that you have discs that need repaired. Are you 90 yos? A construction worker?

    Your orthopedic surgeon neither understands TMS nor believes in it. If he understood TMS he wouldn’t be saying to have surgery, and if he believed in TMS he would already understand it.

    Ask him what nerves would be destroyed if you didn’t have surgery? Is it the peripheral nerves that will be destroyed? They regenerate. So he must be talking about the spinal nerves themselves because they’re the ones that cannot regenerate. But if you had spinal nerves being pressed on now you would likely have lost bowel and bladder function quickly. So it makes little sense unless you haven't given the full story.

    If I was working with you there would be 2 things I would look. First, what were you doing when your pain increased so badly that you needed to go to the hospital? You must have been lifting some really heavy dumbbells up to your attic? The second thing is your screen name here. That name tells me more about your need to TMS than anything else.

    Good luck, make sure you have all your facts about what's going on with you, and also with TMS understanding, then make a cogent decision.

    MWsunin12, JanAtheCPA and plum like this.
  3. balto

    balto Beloved Grand Eagle

    I have asked numerous doctors, I have searched the news, article, internet,... all kind of sources for someone who actually have permanent nerve damage due to "slipped" disc or herniated disc and I could not find a single one. If you know of any case please let me know.
    JanAtheCPA likes this.
  4. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    Foot drop also appears to be a potential sign of a "serious" issue. From a website, and indeed one that takes the overall point of view that most of the time surgery is unnecessary and that most symptoms should be treated conservatively, after discussion of the issues Steve mentions:

    Weakness or numbness in a leg or arm, also points to nerve damage. Weakness and numbness is different from radiating pain into a leg, foot, arm or hand. Radiating pain can be addressed with watchful waiting, but weakness cannot. This weakness includes "foot drop," a condition in which the muscles of the leg and foot are too weak to raise the foot while attempting to walk. Again, nerve damage associated with these symptoms can be permanent if not treated immediately. This would mean the weakness or numbness in your hand or foot would become permanent. This problem should be seen within a few days by a spine specialist.

    http://www.denverspinesurgeons.com/c_hurts.html (Denver Spine Surgeons - Back and Neck Pain Symptoms)

    Similar discussions elsewhere.

    Please make an informed decision with your doctor, or doctors if you choose to get a second opinion.
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2016
    CarboNeVo likes this.
  5. plum

    plum Beloved Grand Eagle


    Never rush into anything irrevocable. I would implore you to take much time contemplating your options. Given Steve O's personal experience here I would defer to his reply. If you are not familiar with his story then do check out his book which chronicles a very personal journey through tragedy to triumph. It is a superb read.

    I would suggest exploring some of David Hanscom's writings. He is a salvage spine surgeon who maintains most operations are not necessary in the first place and he does remarkable work in the tms field. My own healing is full credit to him.

    The medical profession often has a sense of urgency about it when in truth there is no need for hasty decisions to be made. Don't let anyone push you into making a choice one way or the other. Read around. Contemplate. Listen to your intuition. Ask questions. It's your body and no one else has to live with the consequences of the choice you make. Whatever you choose to do, you have the support of the good people here.

    Plum x
    JanAtheCPA likes this.
  6. pspa

    pspa Well known member

    In my opinion it's all well and good to point out the general literature on many surgeries being unnecessary, MRI findings not correlating with pain, etc., but the OP reported she (I presume from her name) cannot (or could not) move her leg. I don't think any of us except those with medical training is really in a position to say whether or not this is an emergency.
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2016
  7. Lady Phoenix

    Lady Phoenix Peer Supporter

    I tend to think that everything is TMS and surgeries are unnecessary mostly all of the time. The fact that you have twins who I believe are infants makes me think this also, but I do know that if you have a serious injury you can get drop foot and if not treated correctly can mean a lifetime of drop foot. This happened to my brother-in-law due to a football injury, but this was a serious accident. If you have the surgery and the pain moves to a new area, you will have your answer. It is your decision.
    JanAtheCPA likes this.
  8. JanAtheCPA

    JanAtheCPA Beloved Grand Eagle

    MOT, I'm sorry you're going through this, it must be scary and distressing for so many reasons.

    All I can advise is: ask Ask ASK a LOT of questions, and as with all surgical decisions, get a second opinion. Even heart patients get second opinions whenever there is doubt as to the efficacy or immediacy of a particular recommendation. As our very wise Plum advises, it's unlikely that you don't have time to look into this carefully before making your decision.

    We're pulling for you, MOT!

Share This Page