Day 4 Most Disheartening Advice from a Doctor

Mac07

Mac07

New Member
I have started the SED program and have found it to be very inspiring as well as challenging, but in a good sense as it is provoking me to confront my emotional blocks and to be aware of them. This particular question really resonated with me as I went to a back specialist in the top of his field in San Francisco to address my severe back pain after trying several other modalities of treatment and was ready to see an authority on back pain. He ordered an MRI and of course it came back negative, showing no major abnormalities or issues. He then prescribed physical therapy and after a month of this; I was still getting no relief from my ongoing back pain. On a follow-up visit to the doctor and confessing my dismay at not finding any relief, he hypothesized that it sounded as if a nerve ending was severed and causing this excruciating pain by hitting the spin or something along those lines, thus triggering pain. He went on to state that lifting heavy objects would most likely engage this action and that I should avoid lifting anything over 5 lbs. I took this to heart immediately as I finally had an explanation and something to grasp onto for the resoning behind the pain. I am pretty sure that this was just his way of placateding me and was just surmizing a long shot of this being the actual cause. This brings me to my current dilema of trying to intrigate all of the philosophies of TMS recovery, especially not being paralyzed by the fear of a onsite of pain from activities. I do particpate in several physical activities but have been brain washed for the lsat 18 years to not lift anything heavy and if I do, my conditioned brain usually triggers a pain episode if I catch myself and realize that I lifted something "too" heavy. I am looking for suggestions as to how to overcome this or from anyone that has had a similar circumstance. I grasp TMS and fully believe in the diagnosis, but I must state that this one area has a grapple on me and I am finding it tuough to just go on faith and move through this hinderance. Many thanks for any input or suggestions.

Much Oblidged, MAC
 
Hi, Mac. I know that it can be overwhelming to grasp and work with all the TMS concepts, but they all boil down to Dr. Sarno's 12 Daily Reminders.
I think the extended version by another member of this TMS community, Herbie, is very helpful.

Herbie’s Extended Version of Dr. Sarno’s 12 DAILY REMINDERS

  1. The pain is due to TMS. This is real pain or anxiety but it is caused by subconscious tensions and triggers, stressors and traits to your reactions and fears and also when at boiling point your conscious tension can and does also cause real pain.
  2. The main reason for the pain is mild oxygen deprivation. This means that when you get in pain or anxiety then the blood is restricted from going to your lower back, for instance. The blood being restricted causes oxygen deprivation which causes the pain. Remember, where there is no oxygen then there is pain in the body. Also, the pain stays because of fear.
  3. TMS is a harmless condition caused by my REPRESSED EMOTIONS so even though you think you can harm yourself from the years of pain you have felt and how you feel in general -- so far no reports have been heard from TMS healing knowledge causing damage to anyone, it only helps.
  4. The principle emotion is your repressed ANGER -- this means under your consciousness lies something that happens automatically to everyone. TMSers have repressions that are stored because of our personality traits, traumas, stressors, fears, strain, etc... When these stored repressions build and build, then eventually they cause the brain to send pain into your body to keep you from having an emotional crises. The mind-body thinks it is helping you.
  5. TMS exists to DISTRACT your attentions from the emotions, stressors, tensions and strains of your personality traits because if you can get distraction then you won’t have to be in emotional turmoil. When you don't face and feel your emotions and they get repressed because you didn't want to deal with something -- they are just adding up in this beaker, ready to pour over and create real pain and anxiety in your body.
  6. Since my body is perfectly normal, there is nothing to fear. So in reality when I fear the pain or anxiety I just cause myself undo strain and tension adding to the beaker of pain. If I fear, then I feed the pain, If I fear, it’s impossible to recondition. Fear keeps the pain and anxiety alive in the body through focus.
  7. Therefore, physical activity is harmless. If I want to work against the pain I could but it’s better to lose some of the pain so when I start my life over I have to be in pain trying to heal because facing the repressions and all the other activities that cause the pain and reversing my fear and focus to them, then I can heal.
  8. I am resuming all normal physical activity. I don't fear moving anymore. I believe in my body’s ability to heal now. I can move as I want. I will not fear moving with a bent back anymore. I will also practice going out and acting normal again, not in fear of what pain might do to me.
  9. The pain is unimportant and powerless. Its only power is how it is hidden -- its illusion, its fear.
  10. I will keep my attention on the emotional issues. I will think about my emotions and feel my emotions throughout the day. I will not judge, criticize or fear my emotions. I will not run from my emotional issues but face every one of them. I will feel my emotions fully and cry if I need to. Then I will release the emotion and get my mind and thoughts back to my life and living in the present.
  11. I am in control of all of this. This is how I recover.
  12. I will be thinking PSYCHOLOGICALLY AT ALL TIMES. This means I will keep my thoughts on psychological issues like happiness, fear and anger -- traits and triggers, conditioning and journaling -- The science behind mind-body/TMS healing, etc.... This way I will not feed my thoughts to the body -- that is a trick of TMS. TMS will always try to get me to focus on the body caused by the pain until I break its show and flair. When I get my attention off physical symptoms and on to emotional issues and psychological issues then I will not feed the fear of the physical issues anymore, thus making the TMS of no pain effect on the body. This will in return, give us the cure and become pain-free.
 
Walt Oleksy said:
Hi, Mac. I know that it can be overwhelming to grasp and work with all the TMS concepts, but they all boil down to Dr. Sarno's 12 Daily Reminders.
I think the extended version by another member of this TMS community, Herbie, is very helpful.

Herbie’s Extended Version of Dr. Sarno’s 12 DAILY REMINDERS

  1. The pain is due to TMS. This is real pain or anxiety but it is caused by subconscious tensions and triggers, stressors and traits to your reactions and fears and also when at boiling point your conscious tension can and does also cause real pain.
  2. The main reason for the pain is mild oxygen deprivation. This means that when you get in pain or anxiety then the blood is restricted from going to your lower back, for instance. The blood being restricted causes oxygen deprivation which causes the pain. Remember, where there is no oxygen then there is pain in the body. Also, the pain stays because of fear.
  3. TMS is a harmless condition caused by my REPRESSED EMOTIONS so even though you think you can harm yourself from the years of pain you have felt and how you feel in general -- so far no reports have been heard from TMS healing knowledge causing damage to anyone, it only helps.
  4. The principle emotion is your repressed ANGER -- this means under your consciousness lies something that happens automatically to everyone. TMSers have repressions that are stored because of our personality traits, traumas, stressors, fears, strain, etc... When these stored repressions build and build, then eventually they cause the brain to send pain into your body to keep you from having an emotional crises. The mind-body thinks it is helping you.
  5. TMS exists to DISTRACT your attentions from the emotions, stressors, tensions and strains of your personality traits because if you can get distraction then you won’t have to be in emotional turmoil. When you don't face and feel your emotions and they get repressed because you didn't want to deal with something -- they are just adding up in this beaker, ready to pour over and create real pain and anxiety in your body.
  6. Since my body is perfectly normal, there is nothing to fear. So in reality when I fear the pain or anxiety I just cause myself undo strain and tension adding to the beaker of pain. If I fear, then I feed the pain, If I fear, it’s impossible to recondition. Fear keeps the pain and anxiety alive in the body through focus.
  7. Therefore, physical activity is harmless. If I want to work against the pain I could but it’s better to lose some of the pain so when I start my life over I have to be in pain trying to heal because facing the repressions and all the other activities that cause the pain and reversing my fear and focus to them, then I can heal.
  8. I am resuming all normal physical activity. I don't fear moving anymore. I believe in my body’s ability to heal now. I can move as I want. I will not fear moving with a bent back anymore. I will also practice going out and acting normal again, not in fear of what pain might do to me.
  9. The pain is unimportant and powerless. Its only power is how it is hidden -- its illusion, its fear.
  10. I will keep my attention on the emotional issues. I will think about my emotions and feel my emotions throughout the day. I will not judge, criticize or fear my emotions. I will not run from my emotional issues but face every one of them. I will feel my emotions fully and cry if I need to. Then I will release the emotion and get my mind and thoughts back to my life and living in the present.
  11. I am in control of all of this. This is how I recover.
  12. I will be thinking PSYCHOLOGICALLY AT ALL TIMES. This means I will keep my thoughts on psychological issues like happiness, fear and anger -- traits and triggers, conditioning and journaling -- The science behind mind-body/TMS healing, etc.... This way I will not feed my thoughts to the body -- that is a trick of TMS. TMS will always try to get me to focus on the body caused by the pain until I break its show and flair. When I get my attention off physical symptoms and on to emotional issues and psychological issues then I will not feed the fear of the physical issues anymore, thus making the TMS of no pain effect on the body. This will in return, give us the cure and become pain-free.
Click to expand...
 
Thanks a bunch Walt...I was beginning to think this forum was a one-way conversation. I appreciate you posting the customized 12 Daily reminders as I had Sarno's on my wall and this version goes even deeper and expands upon the original ! I am also immersed in the SEP program and really appreciating the access to it here and Alan Gordan"s generosity to assist in full recovery of TMS!
 
Yep, Walt is absolutely correct. We just need to keep telling ourselves the truth about our TMS symptoms over and over until it finally sinks in. I also found listening to the audio version of Sarno's Healing Back Pain over and over helpful. It has the good doctor himself reading it, and I found his voice very reassuring. I went to sleep with it every night for awhile in the beginning of my recovery.
 
Ellen,
Thank you for the support and Sarno Audio book suggestion with his voice, I am going to get it and keep it handy for reinforcements!
 
I've found a gently, gently approach is the only way to deal with tms-based fear. As Walt and Ellen have both suggested, a large and quite practical method is to smooth fears rough edges through knowledge. It's a good engagement in terms of quid pro quo but I find it less effective on a visceral level. For this I have to do something to change my physiological state. My favourite ways to shake-it-down are *dancing* to rock music, yin yoga, deep breathing, cloudwatching, cuddling. I find these soothe and quieten my fear while happily inviting warmer and kinder emotional states.

I've noticed we all have preferred means of doing this so it's not a case of one thing is better than another, it really is what works in the moment. When I'm in a bad way I need bottom-up, body-oriented methods to bring me out of it. Others needs a top-down, more mindful approach. Pragmatically speaking most of us mash it up a bit to make it best fit our personality and circumstance.

It does well to challenge the nonsense doctors come out with. They tell us awful things only moments after telling us frightening news. They seem not to realise how vulnerable we are at this time, or else they get a kick out of it. I do wonder about that sometimes.

Any ways, it's bath time so I shall sign off and lose myself in salty waters for a long, long time.

Hugs x

Edit: seeing as my bathing has been interrupted by porridge-making I thought I'd add this consideration from another post I replied to this morning:

"Upstream signals by the Vagus nerve are also important for unlearning conditioned fear responses. That is, without an awareness of what is happening in our guts, we have a much harder time overcoming learned fear responses."

From this article:
http://www.healthyplacecounseling.org/relaxation-the-role-of-the-vagus-nerve/ (Healthy Place Counseling - Relaxation – The Role of the Vagus Nerve)
 
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Mac07 said:
...He ordered an MRI and of course it came back negative, showing no major abnormalities or issues. He then prescribed physical therapy and after a month of this; I was still getting no relief from my ongoing back pain. On a follow-up visit to the doctor and confessing my dismay at not finding any relief, he hypothesized that it sounded as if a nerve ending was severed and causing this excruciating pain by hitting the spin
Click to expand...

You meant SPINE but spin is much more accurate, a Freudian slip, and very appropriate for the topic since TMS is based on psychosomatic psychology that Sigmund Freud was a pioneer of. Your renowned back specialist, does what allopathic conventional doctors do--find structural answers, to what are more likely TMS stress/tension based problems. He was phishing for a structural solution, and he found one for you that sounded plausible, but un-confirmable by MRI. Did he show you that "severed nerve ending"? How did it get severed? It would take a lot of trauma, according to TMS science, to sever a nerve--the back is strong.

The "renowned" back specialist's advice to not lift anything heavier then five pounds, is directly contrary to Dr. Sarno's teachings. He says, "If it's too heavy to lift, you wouldn't be able to lift it."--So just do it!

You have to decide who you are going to believe??--you can't believe both and get better! If you still need convincing that it's TMS, see a TMS physician for an objective mindbody DX.
 
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Mac, about 15 years ago, I was told that I were to:

1. never cross my legs
2. never sit up straight, only from laying on a side position
3. never lift anything in my straight arms
4. never bend forward without supporting my back
5. never sleep without a pillow in between my knees
6. never do yoga because it was hurting me
7. on and on and on

I told the docs: "screw you all", never took any muscle relaxants and painkillers and in 3 years was able to hike long distances with a heavy backpack, lift whatever I wished, dance, as I continued yoga all along. I am now facing another challenge, much harder than a back pain, a diagnosis that offers less than 20% recovery rate. I told the docs "screw you all" and I am getting better. It is much slower than I hoped for, but I am getting better! Dr. Sarno knows his stuff!

Do same! They need to justify their years of training, high salaries and prestige. Screw them all! (or insert words of your choice if you wish),

Best of luck to you!
 
plum said:
I've found a gently, gently approach is the only way to deal with tms-based fear. As Walt and Ellen have both suggested, a large and quite practical method is to smooth fears rough edges through knowledge. It's a good engagement in terms of quid pro quo but I find it less effective on a visceral level. For this I have to do something to change my physiological state. My favourite ways to shake-it-down are *dancing* to rock music, yin yoga, deep breathing, cloudwatching, cuddling. I find these soothe and quieten my fear while happily inviting warmer and kinder emotional states.

I've noticed we all have preferred means of doing this so it's not a case of one thing is better than another, it really is what works in the moment. When I'm in a bad way I need bottom-up, body-oriented methods to bring me out of it. Others needs a top-down, more mindful approach. Pragmatically speaking most of us mash it up a bit to make it best fit our personality and circumstance.

It does well to challenge the nonsense doctors come out with. They tell us awful things only moments after telling us frightening news. They seem not to realise how vulnerable we are at this time, or else they get a kick out of it. I do wonder about that sometimes.

Any ways, it's bath time so I shall sign off and lose myself in salty waters for a long, long time.

Hugs x

Edit: seeing as my bathing has been interrupted by porridge-making I thought I'd add this consideration from another post I replied to this morning:

"Upstream signals by the Vagus nerve are also important for unlearning conditioned fear responses. That is, without an awareness of what is happening in our guts, we have a much harder time overcoming learned fear responses."

From this article:
http://www.healthyplacecounseling.org/relaxation-the-role-of-the-vagus-nerve/ (Healthy Place Counseling - Relaxation – The Role of the Vagus Nerve)
Click to expand...

Thank you for your kind soothing words and compassionate advice on this matter sweet Plum. I like your advice on dealing with and addressing issues in mannerisms that are not prescribed from the norm. I will try to shake it down via some of your channels as well as exploring and paying attention to some of my own.

Hoped you enjoyed your nourishing soak{; Also thanks for the virtual hug. Sending one of gratitude back to you (:
 
Tennis Tom said:
You meant SPINE but spin is much more accurate, a Freudian slip, and very appropriate for the topic since TMS is based on psychosomatic psychology that Sigmund Freud was a pioneer of. Your renowned back specialist, does what allopathic conventional doctors do--find structural answers, to what are more likely TMS stress/tension based problems. He was phishing for a structural solution, and he found one for you that sounded plausible, but un-confirmable by MRI. Did he show you that "severed nerve ending"? How did it get severed? It would take a lot of trauma, according to TMS science, to sever a nerve--the back is strong.

The "renowned" back specialist's advice to not lift anything heavier then five pounds, is directly contrary to Dr. Sarno's teachings. He says, "If it's too heavy to lift, you wouldn't be able to lift it."--So just do it!

You have to decide who you are going to believe??--you can't believe both and get better! If you still need convincing that it's TMS, see a TMS physician for an objective mindbody DX.
Click to expand...
TT...Thanks for chiming in and putting perspective onto this matter with some top-spin...(could not resist). Great questions to also propose to self, regarding proof as opposed to hypothesis or worse an educated guess!! Good dissection of my post and breaking it down with queries and TMS counteracts to implement. Ready to rally and bash a set or 2 when ur in San Francisco! Thanks Again, it means a lot to get valuable responses on here from persons that are in the know from personal experience!
 
TG957 said:
Mac, about 15 years ago, I was told that I were to:

1. never cross my legs
2. never sit up straight, only from laying on a side position
3. never lift anything in my straight arms
4. never bend forward without supporting my back
5. never sleep without a pillow in between my knees
6. never do yoga because it was hurting me
7. on and on and on

I told the docs: "screw you all", never took any muscle relaxants and painkillers and in 3 years was able to hike long distances with a heavy backpack, lift whatever I wished, dance, as I continued yoga all along. I am now facing another challenge, much harder than a back pain, a diagnosis that offers less than 20% recovery rate. I told the docs "screw you all" and I am getting better. It is much slower than I hoped for, but I am getting better! Dr. Sarno knows his stuff!

Do same! They need to justify their years of training, high salaries and prestige. Screw them all! (or insert words of your choice if you wish),

Best of luck to you!
Click to expand...
TG 957..First off thank you for taking the time to chime in on this subject and to share your story as well as using the word "Screw" multiple times! Stoked to hear that you were able to shoulder a big load back packing and getting into some funky poses via yoga! Secondly best of luck and well wishes to your recovery and over-coming your more difficult battle this go around. You have the right attitude and what seems to be a strong will and desire to overcome the status quo of pop medicine and the book text prescribed routes to treatment.Keep fighting the good fight and remember to throw in a lot of compassion for yourself along the route. I have been pissed at plenty of Doc's over the years...hell my dad was one. Iknow realize how narrowed their scope of mental health and alternative health training was and hardly any nutritional training. So why does society put such trust and confidence in them? Its the fricking media and pharmaceutical hype $$$..Most of us need to unlearn the channels we seek for a quick fix and instead travel through recovery with an open mind and opt for great alternatives such as Sarno and his posse of cohorts!
 
Mac07 said:
TG 957..First off thank you for taking the time to chime in on this subject and to share your story as well as using the word "Screw" multiple times! Stoked to hear that you were able to shoulder a big load back packing and getting into some funky poses via yoga! Secondly best of luck and well wishes to your recovery and over-coming your more difficult battle this go around. You have the right attitude and what seems to be a strong will and desire to overcome the status quo of pop medicine and the book text prescribed routes to treatment.Keep fighting the good fight and remember to throw in a lot of compassion for yourself along the route. I have been pissed at plenty of Doc's over the years...hell my dad was one. Iknow realize how narrowed their scope of mental health and alternative health training was and hardly any nutritional training. So why does society put such trust and confidence in them? Its the fricking media and pharmaceutical hype $$$..Most of us need to unlearn the channels we seek for a quick fix and instead travel through recovery with an open mind and opt for great alternatives such as Sarno and his posse of cohorts!
Click to expand...

Mac, in all fairness, doctors are often victims of their own dogmas - see my post on another thread.

http://www.tmswiki.org/forum/threads/beginning.13125/#post-69055 (Day 1 - Beginning)

You are on the right track and there are some very good people here on this forum who will support you.
 
So why does society put such trust and confidence in them? Its the fricking media and pharmaceutical hype $$$..Most of us need to unlearn the channels we seek for a quick fix and instead travel through recovery with an open mind and opt for great alternatives such as Sarno and his posse of cohorts!
Click to expand...

But, I have gotten SCREWED over by the Naturopathic doctor for telling me that my WHITE TONGUE is a by product of Candida and Parasites...These guys have less schooling and practice ancient BULL SHIT that is even more scarier. Now, I have to forget what has been told to me by their bogus test that have no scientific validation....BEWARE of the NATUROPATH BULL SHIT,

Truthfully, I disklike to put "alternative" spin on Dr. Sarno...He is a REAL doctor who made an important discovery that should of put him on the map of discovery...

Kalo
 
Hi, Kalo. I think most (or at least too many) doctors today are just pill-pushers. Pharmaceutical companies even pay them to pass out medication (drugs) that can harm their patients and even kill them. There are many articles and also videos on youtube by respected doctors who say this. Many doctors don't want their patients to get well, so they keep coming back for more tests and medication. I say as you have, screw them. Dr. Sarno and TMS are the alternatives to drugs and surgery.

A neighbor came home from a visit to her doctor and was given a supermarket paper bag full of medications the doctor got from pharmaceutical company representatives. The doctor should have thrown them in the trash instead of giving them to my neighbor.

Children today are committing suicide from the bad effects of prescription medication. Stay away from them and believe instead in TMS emotions causing pain. And do not watch television news. It will just brainwash you into worrying about everything.
 
Hi Walt,

I agree with you 100 percent on white coats. My pink tongue has turned white. It all happened when I was at the unhappiest moement in my life. I went to a doctor and WITHOUT doing test told me that it was tongue fungus and gave me nothing but toxic anti fungus which did NOTHING...

THREE docs said it was fungus without doing any medical SWABING and 6 doctors said it was normal including an oral surgeron..

My tongue looks as bad as miley cyrus, LOL...Google it if you want to see...LOL Any how, not knowing who to believe, I went to the NaturoQUACKS, well they are JUST if not even worst then the MD's...

They put such a NOCEBO and fear in me that I contacted Dr. Schubiner with a picture of my tongue. THANK GOD, he has tried to help me through the brainwashing...Told me to treat it as TMS and that when my stress level goes down he believes the tongue with go back to pink.

I don't mean to hijack this THREAD, but, The MD's aren't the only ones that are corrupted. At least they go to medical school...The NATUROPATHICS are worst and nothing but Vitamin, supplement pushers who make up FAKE ILLNESSES....

I read that vitamins that we take are not NATURAL at all...They have synthetics into them that are just as toxic as medications..

I wish we had MORE Dr. SARNO, Dr. Schubiner's, Dr. Stetcher, (can't spell) that learned how the mind is capbable of all sorts of things....

Kalo
 
Hi, Kalo. Thank heaven more doctors, especially new one, are accepting the MindBody connection in pain,
and many also accept Dr. Sarno's concept of TMS.

I'm staying away from doctors and any health care people. I class them now with politicians and used car salesmen.
 
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