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Conditioned response Running

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by Tuniguts, Oct 2, 2016.

  1. Tuniguts

    Tuniguts Peer Supporter

    I have made incredible progress with SI joint/hip pain, back pain and anxiety. I'm at least 80% better. I have started running again and am having a major issue that I just can't get past.

    When I started running again, I was getting increasingly frustrated with pain. I was in the middle of reading Steve O's book at the time. At one point, I got extremely angry at the pain and started full out sprinting at about the 2 mile mark. I got extreme hip pain right at that moment. It was almost in a new location and a very different pain but in the same general area of my TMS. Ever since then, I get the same exact sensation when I run.

    Now, when I start out my run, I feel great. Relaxed, mindful, confident. At about 2 miles I keep getting the same exact situation. My hip pain starts to appear out of nowhere. I try to concentrate on my breathing, mindfulness, try to not react to the pain. But sure enough it keeps ramping up to the point that I need to stop running. Once, I tried to run through the pain. It was very difficult but I did another mile. After that run, the pain (and accompanying anxiety) lasting for a couple days and then slowly subsided. Im aftraid to keep going and run through the pain as I feel like it makes it worse.

    This is very frustrating as I feel like I know it's going to happen when I go on a run and I fear it. I know that I am causing it to happen but part of me thinks that I created a new injury. I'm not sure how to get past this. I wish I could just not think about it, but that's easier said than done. Any ideas??
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2016
  2. Huckleberry

    Huckleberry Well known member

    Just thought I'd chime in on this. I'm afraid I can't offer you any useful insights or a solution but really it is just to say you are not alone and I am going through the exact same issue.

    My pain is also like that expected of a SI Joint issue but I did have a spinal neuroma discovered on MRI but in all likelihood this is incidental and not responsible for my pain...the general consensus is that it is TMS.

    I am an active hiker and was also a runner. My pain issue started about 5 years ago and I slowly sort of gave into it and gradually stopped running but continued hiking. I seem to get pain flares a few times a year with about 3 or 4 really painful ones which can last a day or a fortnight there is no rhyme or reason to them but I do notice that the more active I am the less likely I am to have flares (go figure, that makes zero sense right). I actually hiked 150 miles in September and didn't have a flare all month during this period.

    The strangest thing though, and where this relates to your experience, is that whilst I can speed hike 14 miles up and down a mountain with very little discomfort if i even think about breaking into what I would consider a run/jog then the pain starts...even my specialist said that if the neuroma was causing my pain it wouldn't respond in this way as there would be no reason for running to be any different from hiking.

    All I can really think about this is that I have somehow convinced myself that hiking is somehow 'safe' for my back and that running is 'dangerous' and will injure it or make my pain worse...I know this is illogical but it appears my psyche has bought into this and as soon as I start to run the niggle starts and this increases to pain.

    I am now trying to counteract this. Whilst all I have really done is hiking over the last couple of years I am now also going out in the evening on dedicated runs to try and break what I believe may be a condition response. Having been used to doing Half-Marathons it is frustrating and annoying (go figure again) to just be going out for 2 to 3 mile jogs but I'm hoping that this will break the thought in my mind that running will cause me pain.

    It really is a tricky thing as on one hand you feel happy you can do something but you start to become fearful of developing and doing more and more as you sort of convince yourself that you are going to break yourself and be back at square one.

    Does any of this ring true for you?
  3. Tuniguts

    Tuniguts Peer Supporter

    Thanks for the reply, Huckleberry. Yes, your situation sounds very similar to what I'm going through. I'm also an athlete and there are certain things I can do endlessly without pain. Especially when distracted. For some reason running is a big road block for me.

    I just read this which really resonated with me: http://www.tmswiki.org/forum/threads/a-word-about-outcome-independence.562/ (A word about outcome independence)

    My plan is to try and just not give a f**k anymore! :) I wish it were just that easy.
    I realize my pain still has so much power over me. Enough is enough right?
  4. Huckleberry

    Huckleberry Well known member

    Yeah...I try to practise outcome independence but what makes this hard at times is that is it so easy to fall into anger and frustration patterns relating to no longer being able to perform at the level you once could. An example of this is maybe being overtaken by another runner/hiker and you immediately get that pang of frustration when you think that X number of years ago you would have been able to stay in front of them etc.

    From my perspective I know this is crazy as I was never a world breaker and was average at best but it is just that feeling they you are not as goos as you once were. I think this opens up a huge can of worms relating to perfectionism and even ageing and that existential fear of mortality. All good fun eh.
  5. TheKingAdRock

    TheKingAdRock New Member

    i think sometimes it's best to progress slowly when it comes to exercise, especially when you aren't 100% convinced it's all just TMS pain.

    for example if you are comfortably running two miles before the pain kicks in then just stick with 2 mile runs for a while. do 2 mile runs twice a week for two weeks, then maybe increase it to 3 times a week and so on. then add on a small distance to your runs, like maybe a quarter mile at a time, so now you are running 2.25 miles 4 times a week etc..
  6. Tuniguts

    Tuniguts Peer Supporter

    Thanks King Ad Rock!! (I really hope I'm talking to one of the beastie boys here- wouldn't that be amazing).
    Yea, upping it slowly is a good call. Thanks!
  7. Tennis Tom

    Tennis Tom Beloved Grand Eagle

    I run in the pool with a flotation belt, 30 minutes daily to maintain general health. Feels great and it's more of a work-out since there is resistance for all the body up to the nose. I've run 13 marathons with NO hip problems. Went back to tournament tennis, a couple of bad relationships, a couple of bad yoga moves and whamo, hip pain and can't run on the courts--but I can hobble real fast and have been described as deceptively fast. Going down to the pool for a run now.

  8. Ines

    Ines Well known member

    Hi Tuniguts,
    I had a similar situation when I felt migraines coming on. Sometimes I would try to power through it and make it go away somehow. I'd keep repeating mantras and affirmations. I'd try to calm down and meditate. In the end, somehow I learned from books and this forum that I was judging myself and the pain. It was my personality that felt like I was failing and that I wasn't doing this TMS stuff good enough.
    I read Be Well say in a post to not think about if the pain comes but when the pain comes. That has helped me tremendously. Sometimes I feel it coming on and instead of thinking if I say ok when it comes I'm taking this pain med and then I'll lay down and then a few minutes later it's gone.
    Also, just link it psychologically and keep reminding your brain that it's your repressed emotions in your unconscious.
    Somehow the fear and anticipation and judging of the pain seems to bring it on. Next time you go running just say when the pain comes at 2 miles I will slow it down or walk. Don't be afraid. Don't feel like a failure. Just say this is TMS and eventually it will go away but for now I'm going to be persistent and do what I can.
    It has changed a lot for me. I hope it helps you.
    Cara likes this.
  9. intense50

    intense50 Well known member

    Struggling with kinda the same. I was 98% free running 10 k almost daily. 12 days ago I ran a half marathon and felt good. After the race my left hip and side were sore. Yesterday I ran 10 k light piriformis and sciatica which leave the more I run. Actually feel good after. Once I stop I stiffen up piriformis butt pain sciatica.
  10. lupercmda

    lupercmda Peer Supporter

    Thanks to intense50 for going back an forth on messages. I have had pain since June and mainly sciatica and piriformis pain. Decided screw it I am going to run again as Steve O did. Well first 60 steps butt tightened on left side which is where the pain is. and could barely make it out of my driveway. But worked thru it was able to run 1.5 miles for the first time in 8 months. Well I got to the last 30 steps and was feeling pretty good. But then my right knee started hurting and is killing me today. The other side from my butt pain. So should I take this as a good sign that it is moving around? Hurts so bad I can hardly walk. How about some recommendations. Should I go out and walk and run today? I have never had knee problems in my life and I am 60 years old.

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