1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this link: http://go.tmswiki.org/newprogram
    Dismiss Notice

Chronic Daily Pain... Hip flexor, hip, and glutes

Discussion in 'Support Subforum' started by Secret Habit, Apr 28, 2020.

  1. Secret Habit

    Secret Habit Peer Supporter


    I have overcome many symptoms of TMS but sometimes it rears its ugly head...

    I have dealt with insane hip pain over the last handful of years and never ever thought of it to be TMS... It is making sense in my mind that its TMS and I want some support in this

    I sit ALOT for work and life in general, I am fit and healthy, I drum, I bike, I run, etc... Its easy to assume I have hip flexor issues and so on (Psoas muscle).

    However, I do feel the pain moving around, I do feel it flare up at times like before bed or in bed, and I feel it can be good for a week or so then back to pain... Its such a common injury or issue that I have always justified it as a tight muscles but after having a week or so of no real pain after doing consistent yoga and relaxing myself, I am now back to a lot of pain...

    I know its a weird time in our lives with the pandemic, we had a shooting around here recently, work has had its stress with the changes, and I have been thinking about money a lot with the uncertainty... ALL signs of TMS right? lol

    I guess one of my main questions is:
    -Do these muscles actually get tight, and require a healthy lifestyle? or is it literally just TMS?

    I feel our muscles do need to be fit and strong so maybe that's my catch... I feel like my legs, especially my supporting muscles are super weak and that's part of my issue

    Is this the lie and fear I need to give up??

    Would love some help
  2. Secret Habit

    Secret Habit Peer Supporter

  3. Baseball65

    Baseball65 Beloved Grand Eagle

    I have a question. Why did you ever discount this as TMS? I know people are learning about TMS from sources other than Sarno and all of them seem to be editorializing their pain "Well this is TMS but THIS? This is structural...WTF?"

    Of course hip pain is TMS. It was one of the main symptoms that first took me down... complete inability to move my leg forward... Many, many time during my 18 month odyssey through the system I would ask questions like: "It feels like something is being pinched HERE (points towards hip) Why do you think it is that disc in my back?"
    ..and their answer was actually half right. They said that any nerve down the leg could be affected as they run through that area of the back....creating any number of symptoms.
    Their theory though does NOT account for the symptoms changing. Sarno diagrammed this in his OG Book.

    BUT...sometimes it hurt in my back, sometimes it burned in my calf, sometimes the butt, sometimes down to the tips of my toes???? Then...it started on the right side even though my 'damage' was on the left.

    Sarno's theory of ischemia and it being a REGIONAL process makes waaaaaay more sense than any of the half-mushy-BS answers I got from the long line of specialists I saw.

    I build stuff for living... I can think through a system fairly well.... if a foundation slips on the left side, the structure doesn't lean right.... But... if it's built on unstable ground it will tilt left right and every which way. Ischemia, or lack of localized blood flow can cause all sorts of shifting symptoms... it is unstable ground. That was Sarno's new diagnosis that required new treatment... the ischemia is brought on by tension, thus the original name (which quickly became obsolete) Tension Myositis Syndrome.

    and on the healthy lifestyle? I am super active, BUT I tend to binge eat, I Smoke, lay around for days on end when I am bored, and in my life I have consumed enough drugs and alcohol to kill several touring funk bands. I can drink a couple of gallons of coffee and diet coke in one day. I am not a poster child for healthy living, for sure, but I also deleted those old wives tales about pain coming from 'weak postural muscles'....that's from the 'Medieval Structural Model' Sarno RAILED on. According to that theory I should be in agony... but I am not.

    Sarno is super duper clear about this. If you read "Healing Back Pain', you will learn that exercise aimed at strengthening the 'core' for the sake of avoiding pain, actually Brings It on! Exercise for enjoyment and health's sake is fine and encouraged.

    My legs aren't particularly strong... I wish they were because that is where power comes from in hitting.... But it hasn't caused me any pain.ever. Just frustration that I can't hit a ball as far as I would like. Ego.

    That is a lot closer to the 'problem' than any body strength issues. Hope that helps

    Northwood and Secret Habit like this.
  4. Secret Habit

    Secret Habit Peer Supporter

    So good, thank you so much

    Its such a good question... I guess it just never made sense to me because there were variables that made sense such as weak muscles and such... I can make sense of that more than carpal tunnel for say

    I am grateful for your reply - Thank you! Cant wait to rid myself of this pain
  5. dea329

    dea329 New Member

    I don't have an answer for this but I'm trying to believe I theory I recently came up with. In the summer of 2018 my transfer came through for a job I thought I wanted across the country. Literally that same day I got the news, I began experiencing extreme tightness in my hip(I think psoas) and glutes. It was so tight I could barley externally rotate my right hip/leg. There was no injury, but for two entire years I was 100% convinced I structurally "changed" something in my body. Fast forward about two months later. I woke up in the middle of the night with extreme sharp pain in my groin area. I also only feel this when I externally rotate my hips. Now I was convinced something was definitely structurally wrong, I sought out three doctors, three chiropractors and two physically therapists(3 months of hip/glute strengthening exercise). Nothing helped. I started self diagnosing myself and stretched about 30 minutes everyday for a year and a half. Still, nothing helped. Still super sharp pains in my groin and difficulty externally rotating my left hip. Last month I learned about TMS. Immediately I listened to "Healing Back Pain" and knew I was indeed suffering from this most of my adult life. I still couldn't shake the feeling in the back of my mind this wasn't structural, so before I went all in of the TMS theory I got an MRI of my hip. Results came back last week that I have a torn labrum in my hip and stage 3(out of 4) cartilage damage. My symptoms fit the exact symptoms of a labrum tear. However, for the first time ever, I began to not feel scared of this. I looked up some Youtube videos and came across three different TMSers that had complete labrum tears, never had surgery and claim to be 100% pain free after going all in on TMS. So, back to my theory. I'm trying to believe that the tightness and pain I was experiencing from my emotional state in 2018 is tricking my brain for the labrum tear to cause of all this pain. After all, if others have the same diagnosis as I do, can't I become pain free as well?(without surgery) Baseball65, I'd love your input.
    Northwood likes this.
  6. Baseball65

    Baseball65 Beloved Grand Eagle

    "Coincidence is an agnostic's way of talking about divine intervention"

    That was just sort of what happened to me when my symptoms began. I GOT a new job that I had been wanting for a long time. I went from a day player on TV shows to doing 'feature films' which meant more stability economically... however the guy who I would be reporting to was like a military drill sergeant, so I had to shut my normal goofy,joke telling/laughing personality down to zero. Oh yea... and my hip stopped working. and my butt cheek spasmed. Oh yeah, I had just had my second son and was the only source of family income.... oh yeah, and my wife and I were having problems. Oh yeah, and I wasn't playing music or baseball.....

    I told my sons to give my corpse to the Cadaver farm in Knoxville when I die, but maybe they ought to do a post mortem MRI because I can ASSURE you I have tears all along every joint in my body...knees, shoulders, hips. You name it. I can still throw 500 pitches at batting practice no problem. Probably a MESS in there, if I bothered to look... I don't even want to know.

    Sarno said, and I agree, that tears and twists and scarring and such, are the normal nature of aging. Before the advent of the MRI, pitchers threw 12 inning complete games and pitched into their 40's. No 'pitch counts' (pussies) It wasn't until all this diagnostic stuff came around that people became so fricking fragile.

    I imagine that the 'tear' is just there... I really believe this though I know I would be shooshed by the medical world.... the same one that condemned me to a life of 'be careful' at 32 and I am 54 and still rocking it pain free.. F those guys and all of their opinions.... Cui bono ? THEM.. More money, more machines, but nobody ever seems to get free???

    Two of my friends have fake hips. Both had catastrophic accidents. Neither is in pain... they just sort of roll funny when they walk (like I do apparently).

    I really thing it was always there.... TMS is odd, like it has some sort of intelligence. Sarno touched on this.. like there might be a statistical connection between tears and pain BUT it was because your body which is an integrated system, chose something that you would believe. And your mind is part of that matrix and works with what it has...and if you need a distraction, credibility is important

    I know from years of fighting off attempted attacks, it always goes after something I will 'believe'. If I have a big show coming up, my hands or arms... If I am working on a build job, back or legs... if I have an important singing gig, my voice starts to go.... "OCD of the BODY" is what I have always called TMS.

    ..and I think the proof in "the systems" mistake is that No one ever gets 'well' after they rip you up and sew you back together (allegedly)... probably because that wasn't the problem in the first place. My brother had his shoulder fixed from a 'tear'... as soon as he was 'better', his other shoulder went.... Now he has chronic back pain... My Bro at work just had a spinal fusion.... now he has a torn something or other in his knee... it's like a subscription service. I canceled my subscription back in '99
    I have NEVER seen a person treated for something like your hip who didn't within a year or so develop another 'problem'

    I am totally Biased. I have been doing it this way for so long and not had problems, I don't ever listen to any medical structural crap at all.... too me it is all like the adults in a peanuts Movie "Waa wah wah, waaah, waaah wah wah"

    The pain is very real, but the real is your life, not your labrum.

  7. dea329

    dea329 New Member

    @Baseball65 Wow. I got the chills reading this. THANKY YOU. Our stories sound very similar and you have regained my TMS confidence. After I got the MRI results my thought process was "Well, I know I have TMS. But I guess I also have a structural issue to address as well". I don't think it was a coincidence that the tightness/range of motion started first(without an injury) and then months later attacked the same side with shooting groin pains. I guess TMS is just doing what it does best; attacking my vulnerabilities. It is right to say that once I address my repressed emotions, the tightness will subside along with my symptoms. I have been journaling religiously for 3 weeks and on day 16 of the SEP program. Also, I have been getting stabbing pains in my hip 2-3 times a day when I walk, which I NEVER had before I journaled(sneaky TMS), but from what I hear that is a good sign. I'd love to hear your symptoms about your hip not working!
    Northwood and Baseball65 like this.
  8. Baseball65

    Baseball65 Beloved Grand Eagle

    It felt like it wasn't my hip.... like it wasn't part of my body. Like it needed some sort of monstrous stretch in some direction and it would all be OK. All around the joint was weak and I couldn't walk without assisting the leg by pulling on my trouser but the HIP was the focus of the weakness. It felt heavy and alien. If I pushed it out ward or frontward it ached and was painful.

    I have had that feeling return twice since '99.... both times were at Baseball games and both times were during warm-ups when I found out I was NOT in the starting line-up and was furious. I knew it was TMS immediately, but I had to play through the games with it (I got into the game, just didn't START ...ego/rage/failure/competitive/memories of childhood failure/etc...filled up several pages in my folder)

    Going back to all of us being integrated systems but slightly different, after all of this time I can usually guess which department I am bugged about (personal, financial, relationships, competition, work problems) By which symptoms are trying to start. Remember Sarno said he didn't treat pain... the object was to keep it from happening.

    I would imagine the hip has a lot to do with competitiveness... come to think of it, even my two friends who lost their hips are some of the most competitive bastards I know... not on the surface...deep down. On the surface we want to be nice guys so people will like us,,, but on the deep down inside we want to dominate our environment to overcome our fears and concerns.

    If we had a contest to see who was the least competitive, I would totally win. (LOL)
  9. dea329

    dea329 New Member

    @Baseball65 Thanks again for the response. I've read over your first response about 10 times and then again to my wife and we are both in agreement that it is TMS. I know that I need to get to 100% belief for this to work, it's just that damn MRI and my exact symptoms of the tear that are messing with my head. When you said that TMS has some sort of an intelligence and attacks something that we would believe, it clicked for me. In college I lifted weights hardcore. I developed tennis elbow which had me out for months. Then a year later I had this stabbing pain in my left hand which traveled to my right hand a few weeks later that both popped up during my workouts so I just assumed they were the cause. I worked as a mail carrier for 5 years, walked 11 miles a day on my route. Out of the blue I got ankle pain/clicking in my left ankle that went to my right ankle months later. I ended up resigning because the pain was so bad and no doctor could find anything wrong. I am now self employed and have a whole list of subconscious issues that I just recently started bringing to surface after starting the SEP. Could this be the cause? Possibly.

    What ultimately relieved you of your symptoms?

    In a weird way, I don't want to be cured overnight. Yes, I'm in a lot of pain but I believe that it is happening for me. I think I was given TMS to find my "true self". I have so many repressed emotions that I'm just starting to get a handle on and once I do, I believe my pain will disappear and I can begin the new chapter in my life stronger and wiser than ever.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
    Baseball65 likes this.
  10. Baseball65

    Baseball65 Beloved Grand Eagle

    I , too, am a Jobber and work for whomever, whenever... it is liberating but also scary. Huge TMS tickler. Self reliance

    well, first, what You are doing right now... taking the information and looking at it in perspective of my life. Virtually every symptom series I had since age 6 corresponded to some rage inducing event... not conscious rage, but to the unconscious child Sarno Talks about in his text.

    I had a neck issue at age 6. My mom dumped me in another country and disappeared on a trip right after my Dad died.

    I had asthma/breathing issues at age 13 when I had to go and fight my way through the 'tough guy' gauntlet in my neighborhood...alone.

    I had paralysis at age 19...when I realized I had No plan for life and all my friends were at college and working on careers. I won't bore you with the next decade (LOL)

    First I read "Healing Back Pain" By Sarno. I took the text as ...well Text, like in a book on trigonometry. Each page was information for me to ingest, apply to my life, meditate upon and many times there is clear directives on what must happen for healing. I went out on 'Field trips' and inspected my life and my responses to stuff. I followed every suggestion. I kept a running notebook and scribbled down every memory about pain issues, like what you did in this previous post. I also thought back to the interior state of my consciousness at the time... How was I feeling about Money, Marriage, My spiritual life, friends, family, career?????

    As I read and re-read it became clear that I had been suffering from TMS at various intensity levels for my whole life. It seemed to go away when I had any self induced DRAMA (drugs ,alcohol, the court system, locked up in homes, GF's leaving me,etc) and it always came back when everything was 'OK'. That too is consistent with Sarno's observations.

    and this is profound which gives me the feeling you won't be in pain much longer. This is a verity. I learned that the conscious me that interacts with the world is the tip of an iceberg...and that Rage, shame, regret, remorse, guilt and a few others are really powerful to the part of me, that until I read Sarno, I didn't think existed. It was a huge humbling spiritual event to find out there is all that crap going on over which we don't have a lot of control. However the GOOD NEWS is we can reach a detente!

    I got up and hit the book every morning and set aside time to reflect and write. After about a week or so, I started to get results at figuring out where CONDITIONING had begun to rule a large part of my life, but was invisible. Every time I found a little piece, I BROKE IT.

    I made lists of stuff that angered me and why. Work. Nepotism. Political. TV. elitism. Moronism. Double standards. Male/female relation crap.....ad infinitum. Whatever bugs you consciously. Looking at it tells the unconscious that you are on to it, and it is a huge part of the recovery phase, as it renders the pain useless.

    I did the 12 reminders every day mid-day. I returned to all the things I did before the pain came (playing guitar, lifting weights negligently, rough housing, riding my bike) and ditched every single thing in my house that was connected to the 'pain industry'...support belts, meds, books, seat cushions.

    I looked outside of myself for confirmation (like we did two posts ago on this string) and realized that No one is ever paroled from the pain world and that most of my friends with chronic anything tended to be TMS types. It was hard to shut up, but I did..... we all tend to evangelize once we get the gift. It's part of our personalities to want to help others and it doesn't always work out so well (LOL)

    anytime anybody mentioned anything that had to do with the 'Medieval structural pain mythology"... I went Charlie Brown adult voice in my head "waahh wahh wah wah , wah wah"...words like 'disc' 'torn tendon' 'fascitis' ' lumbago' ' deterioration'....

    ...and I looked up and I was cured. It just went away. I was out riding my bike, throwing balls, in the cages hitting, and working 12 hours a day on stage. I had my knee collapse after i had been back at work for a week, but having been forewarned this might happen I just laughed and kept doing the stuff and it was gone in days.

    and that's about it. There was no internet back then. I had no peer group. it was often times scary and I would have a wave of fear... "What if this is wrong? What if I am fucking myself up worse? No one else believes me" (This was '99)

    ..and I would go home. Read, reflect, and Re-set.... I also have been sort of 'punk rock fuck it' my whole life so that particular liability became an asset.
    ....and I promised myself and God that when I got healed I would do everything in my power to help others because it was one of the darkest moments in my life. I felt wholly abandoned by the world and the universe (alienation to the eenth) and now I feel like god's spoiled child.

    and referring to your statement again, yes, the continual excursions to the inside have raised the quality of my life and helped me edit out the BS... If I die today at work, I have had an AWESOME life...and TMS had a big part in quality control.
    Northwood and Rainstorm B like this.
  11. dea329

    dea329 New Member

    @Baseball65 Thank you very, very much for your responses. I've been absorbing/obsessing so much of Sarno, Ozanich and Schubiner these past three weeks but for whatever reason your words have been the most comforting. But that's exactly what I do when a new symptom pops up. I obsess. The weirdest feeling rushed over me, as for the first time in my life I'm believing that there is no stretch, no exercise, no vitamin that is going to cure me of my pain. It's inside of ME. It's always been. I was telling my wife today "I'm only 31 years old. Why did God bless me with my pain and point me in the direction of TMS." Most people will go on their entire life with physical pain and most likely never know the cure was inside of them the whole time.

    It's been a long two years with these symptoms(I know many have suffered 20+ years). I feel like I've lost my identity. No one else would know that though. I'm always smiling, trying to people please. I can only imagine the subconscious rage I created. Trying to manifest a healthy, pain free life is difficult, almost like I'm purposely trying to rob my future self of these freeing emotions.

    "....and I promised myself and God that when I got healed I would do everything in my power to help others because it was one of the darkest moments in my life. " Strangely enough, I've been manifesting a video where I am telling the world how I conquered this, hoping to inspire millions. My wife thinks I should start documenting now, why wait unit I'm healed. Still trying to get to the 100% belief.

    Thank you so much for your kind words and comfort.
    Secret Habit and Baseball65 like this.
  12. Mr Hip Guy

    Mr Hip Guy Peer Supporter

    As my user name suggests, I know of what you speak here. Somewhere on this forum I have a thread of my own, but suffice to say I am certain that hip issues can come from TMS. Labral tear and FAI here, had the surgery, REGRET IT, as pain returned just as I was finishing rehab/PT and getting back to usual activities (running). It wasn't until I recognized it as TMS and started treating it that it began to retreat. I have had some relapses but the fact I can make it go away seems to prove it's TMS. It's a son of a gun though and stubborn/tenacious. Of course I realize that means *I* am stubborn/tenacious. :)

    And yeah, listen to Baseball65, he has given me some excellent guidance as well.
    Baseball65 and Secret Habit like this.
  13. Mr Hip Guy

    Mr Hip Guy Peer Supporter

    Dea329 - I know you sent a private message asking about my labrum tear symptoms etc but probably best to reply here so others can benefit from reading.

    I had all the typical symptoms - pain in the classic/prototypical "C" surrounding the hip ranging from the groin to the front and to the back medial glute. It moved around though, made me close to insane researching all the symptoms and how some people experience pain in one area vs another. I particularly remember my surgeon's PA saying that there are a lot of nerve endings near the labrum and that the tear can "refer" pain to a number of different places. I took it hook line and sinker at the time but wow what a bunch of BS! The labrum supposedly has low blood flow therefore it "won't" heal on its own but you're telling it me it is loaded with nerve endings?

    Again, I regret the surgery as now I am fixating on thinking that the procedure (labrum repair and "rim trim" of the hip capsule - ie. grinding bones) will cause other problems like predisposing me for severe arthritis later etc. However, I come to grips with it because had I NOT had that surgery I would have probably never encountered Sarno/TMS and even if I did there would be some part of my brain that still thought the surgery was the fix. It's almost like a paradox.

    I do get relapses of symptoms though. I just had one in the last few weeks in fact. Despite using all my learned techniques, it drove me crazy and had me re-questioning everything. However, this past weekend I did a 55K trail run on that hip. Extremely technical terrain with a ton of elevation gain/loss so it took a long long time (9+ hours). Went perfectly fine. After warming up in the first 5 miles or so, it didn't make a peep. I guess I beat it down. :) Probably more factually, I forced blood flow to that area through all that leg/hip motion and it simply couldn't present me with any symptoms. This happens all the time, I wake up and every step is painful - I'm hobbling around thinking how the heck am I going to run today - then I go out and run 10m and I feel great the rest of the day.

    Anyway I hope I answered your questions, but it's really best not to get wrapped up in all the symptoms and exact areas of pain etc.
  14. Northwood

    Northwood Well known member

    As I learn more about TMS, and you find that's something you experience
    Nice to see that you're onto this in your early thirties. I'm around sixty and figuring out the things you are describing throughout your thread with Baseball65. A nice exchange of insights!

    About the tms pain around hips & butt, here's an example of how TMS acted in my life (before I knew what it was). I got a great fellowship to attend a month-long writing retreat out West last fall. So out I went. I'd been dealing with chronic back pain most of my life but things were in an edgy so-so tolerable state at that time. Then the DAY AFTER I sat down to right: back pain. I blamed it on a hard kitchen chair I'd set up at my writing desk. That chair, used once, messed me up for a whole month. Two hours in a chair, I believed, gave me a month of pain! The pain continued after I got back. Finally, in January I first learned about TMS. When I began to look at my emotional life, all the deep rage and fears I had around my writing life and around a terrible relationship with a dying parent (which factored into my feelings about my writing life) I came to understand that the pain had nothing to do with a metal chair. Now, I look back on all of the stretching and massage tools I used, all the PTs I saw, trying to address my pain as structural, and I can really see the folly of it. I've done 45 minute morning stretching routines for years to preserve my back, to prevent pain day by day. Yet I've noticed when I've gone backpacking I've been just fine, and no morning routine in the woods. I always wondered about that, why so? What fluke? Over the past few months, I'm getting a better understanding. Best wishes to you!
  15. Rene100

    Rene100 Peer Supporter

  16. Rene100

    Rene100 Peer Supporter

    Hi there....
    As a (not knowing at time) lifer to the Symptom imperative....I have first hand experience of TMS in leg/foot/ back muscles. It's scary what the brain can do to us.
    I work in healthcare....but I thought I was dying. I had just been laid off one of my jobs an my brother was abusing me emotionally...boom...legs..feet hips back spasm so hard I can't walk for four months!!!!!! Fast fwd...had brain scans...blood tests...saw top neurologist.....NOTHING. the specialist told me it was all psychological in nature and ...can even cause seizures!!!
    That scared me to death so I read both dr Sarnia books like crazy for about two months.....spasms are mostly gone.
    So.....I believe your muscle pain is TMS but be sure to get an MRI on your hip in case it is arthritis....but it's truly incredible what havoc our bodies can do to us to avoid rage/anger/unfairness/hurt/rejection etc.
    Good luck my friend
  17. Mr Hip Guy

    Mr Hip Guy Peer Supporter

    Just a little anecdote as to how bad TMS can be:

    When I was at my lowest with my hip pain, and in the last few weeks before my scheduled surgery, I had been instructed by my various doctors/orthos to "rest, rest, rest" so I had resorted to using crutches and a ton of bed rest. I skipped some family gatherings in the name of "rest." I distinctly remember the feeling at one point that my hip was going to come dislocated out of its socket while showering, that's how weak I had become with the fear gripping me. Looking back at that time I am continually astonished at how powerful it all was.
  18. Rene100

    Rene100 Peer Supporter

    To Mr. Hip Guy...
    Did you get MRI or ever find out what caused it? Just curious...my brother had hip pain for years ..turned out he was bone-on-bone and needed hip surgery. So just worried for you that's all.
    In regard to it being TMS...oh yes....TMSis a tricky monster.
    I couldn't walk for 6 months thinking I had multiple sclerosis or a brain tumour...all medical tests normal.
    But like you....if I even "turned" in middle of the night....(we all do tons of times...but as Dr. Sarno explained...TMS picks a "normal" activity and then flares....it's so crazy! So I would wake up screaming and scare my neighbours...that's how bad pain was.
    Oddly...I had an actual small back fracture....and it didn't cause that much pain..I just couldn't move properly...it felt weird.
    Whereas TMS.....its pain driven (as distraction from rage) or nerve or muscle like spasms...dizziness...and yes even heart arythmia....which I had but those symptoms left when my stomach became inflamed!!!!!
    Oh man........so I feel for you Mr.Hip Guy...this TMS is so INCREDIBLY POWERFUL....it's really quite mind boggling isn't it. Thank God for Dr. Sarno and for this site so we can talk about it...I find it helps so much!!!
  19. Mr Hip Guy

    Mr Hip Guy Peer Supporter

    Oh yes, got the MRI, had the surgery, all that. Somewhere here in the forum I have a thread about my experience. But the TL/DR is that it was all TMS, I am totally convinced it was.
  20. Rene100

    Rene100 Peer Supporter


Share This Page