Cracking/Popping joints it's really getting to me

I still have to do a vacation update which went REALLY well overall . I will do a separate thread.

But here comes the spiral right? Even though I was expecting to have a worsening of symptoms (thank you @dlane2530 you prepared me).

We got back 2 days ago and I have ran 2x since we got home. I've been trying to keep up the activity with those runs and taking time to do my TMS work and taking naps that are sorely needed after a 24 days trip, but after my run last night I started to focus on my cracking/popping left ankle which is my dystonic side I don't run evenly on and oh man today TMS has got me good.

This ankle has been doing this since April of last year, just days before I developed Runner's Dystonia in that same ankle and descended into hell. I've had an MRI on it with nothing of course. Cracking and popping has been my freaking life since then. My toes and feet everywhere crack and pop. When my knees have bothered me (which I overcome of a lot of on this trip) they crack and pop. It drives me crazy because I think structural structural structural because of these scary noises and why are they doing this. Something is not aligning or something is off. Or #1 Fear "I hurt myself by running/walking too much. Too much too fast too soon. Even if X body part was okay a year ago, I've run/walked so much since then now it must be an injury." Of course it's perfect for my TMS because it knows it freaks me out.

So looking for some experiences with joint cracking and popping, no matter where it was for you. (When my back pops or shoulder pops I don't care, those aren't involved as much with walking or running.)

It does come and go in severity but it's all the freaking time. Sometimes it can be with every step and I will play music or a podcast not to hear it.

My working theory, even though YES I KNOW I NEED TO NOT THINK WHY, is because stuff is tight and that tightness comes and goes with the deep down fear and rage, but man it's driving me crazy can't you see? At least now I'm less panicky and more mad about the whole thing which seems like progress to me but I need some words people please today.

Thank you my friends.

 

Yep. Your TMS is working perfectly to distract you. That's its purpose. Don't let it. Tell yourself that cracking/popping means nothing. Shift your attention to something absorbing. Music/podcasts are fine, but maybe you need something even more than that.

 

Thank you Ellen. I needed to read that.

After I posted this I just go so mad. I have this like energy that needs to get out. It's quite an experience. The work is hard and I know I'm early in it but it's worth it.

 

As you know, it hit me hard, too, when I got home from my trip! It's so challenging to stick to your guns about it being TMS when it's so strong!
Hang in there. The symptoms reduced a lot for me after the first few days. I'm now in a much better groove. You'll get through this blowback!

 

Hi, @dystonicrunner
I’m gonna be honest— you talk way too much about dystonia (a medical term with scary and negative connotations.) It’s even in your name on this website. All of this focus on medical symptoms only 100% reinforces to your brain that it’s got you. Dr. Sarno says, you won’t ever get better with so much focus on the physical/medical. You are reinforcing your TMS’s hold on you.

You’ve got to believe you’ve got TMS and stop doubting. Focus on your EMOTIONS. That’s all. No matter what.

Dr. Hanscom (a spine surgeon who healed from 15 years of TMS) says we should never even discuss symptoms. Ever. It makes things worse. As part of his healing, he didn’t even discuss symptoms with his family. (Super hard to do!)

Here’s a good quote for you from The MindBody Prescription by John Sarno:

“Fear is better than pain as a distractor. We must prove to our brains that we know what is going on, that we are not misled and, above all, that we are not intimidated or afraid. This is a contest, between our logical conscious and our irrational unconscious. It is truly a tale of two minds.”

 

Fair enough. I was suggested to change my name at the beginning but I didn't. Guess that's just gonna be an oh well at this point. I had my reasons and still do.

I definitely still have the doubt. It will take time. Thanks for the quote.

 

You are so right. I don’t know if any of us gets there 100 percent. Some days are better than others. I will say I have many of your same symptoms ( including the D-word) —and it has taken me quite a while to calm down about it.

You know more than you think! You are on the right track. The tightness causes popping, which is caused by fear and rage.

Another angle to this is the adrenaline causing tightness. And Claire Weekes talks all about how to heal that with time, floating past fear, and being distracted with living life.

Have you ever read Tamara Gurin’s ( @TG957) book, Defying the Verdict? She’s a big inspiration!

Also, The MindBody Prescription, starting at page 139, is awesome.

 

‘We got back 2 days ago and I have ran 2x since we got home. I've been trying to keep up the activity with those runs and taking time to do my TMS work and taking naps that are sorely needed after a 24 days trip, but after my run last night I started to focus on my cracking/popping left ankle which is my dystonic side I don't run evenly on and oh man today TMS has got me good’.

You emphasised running twice & keeping up the activity of running since you have been back. Correct me if I’m wrong please but seems like you are putting pressure on yourself. I love the idea of much needed rest & naps but how about some rest for the body & perhaps engaging in something else, some other hobby to focus on rather than on your body?

I know that many ppl experience popping & cracking in their joints but are completely pain free. Dr Schubiner & Dr Sarno both say it’s completely harmless.

Thoughts:

Are you putting undue pressure on yourself to perform?

Has running become an activity where instead of feeling pleasure you feel you are focusing more & more on body parts?

Are you focusing on running to avoid other things including emotions in your life?

What do you feel when you can’t run?


All the best.

 

[QUOTE="Diana-M, post: 160522, member: 22630"

Have you ever read Tamara Gurin’s ( @TG957) book, Defying the Verdict? She’s a big inspiration!
[/QUOTE]

Yes I have absolutely read her book which I found when I was lurking on this forum and helped me take the leap to go full TMS on my recovery.

I read Dan Buglio's book in late February recommended by another RD friend who probably was so sick of me talking about my pain. But did not really accept it for all of my "issues" until May 1st when I had a major flare and said this has to be the way. So I'm really only what I would consider 10 weeks in.

I have read Pain Free You, Healing Back Pain, The Divided Mind, the Mind Body Prescription, Defying the Verdict, and Mind Your Body.

I started Scbubiner's book today Unlearn your Pain. He really speaks to me.

Listening to podcasts, journaling. But also giving myself grace and trying to live life and not have TMS Recovery be another obsession.

Thank you for answering my question about the tightness. I have 2 medical degrees, a degree in Biochemistry, and I am a medical practitioner so sometimes I still need to know these things as for me this is not just whatI have learned as a patients in a medicalized society, but it's legit 9 years of my post high school education and 22 years of a career I'm navigating a new understanding of.

 

When TMS came, yes I did put myself on undue pressure to perform. Boston was very close for me.

But now? No. I have only ran 60 something times in a year and a half (some of these only being a few minutes) when I used to run every day and I'm grateful for however short and "bad" it is with symptoms. I am not sure you have seen my other posts but what I was diagnosed with and occurred to me was so severe and I don't want to go on about the symptoms and what happened.

In the past yes, probably I did run to avoid other things. I literally had nothing else in my life. I hated and hate many things about my life. It also is how I had found my new friends in a state that I knew nobody so it is what connected me to other people.

It was also an identity that I had that I felt was my own. It didn't involved a career or relationships to others. It was one I got to pick for myself and that I didn't "need" to do, or have no choice in.

Running was also my "me" time. I felt so much joy in it. I got rock out to my music. Feel good about myself. Process all of my feelings. It was my flow state.

But yeah for sure I wanted to be better and faster. I definitely have a different attitude towards it now. When you've lost so much and been away from something that you love so much for so long, every little bit I've been able to do has been a blessing and so beautiful.

 

I do have other hobbies other than physical ones. Just don't feel I need to speak about them here unless anyone else plays Minecraft or watches Big Brother? The season 27 cast just came out!

Also I am pushing myself to do bodily stuff as I've been terrified of it for 18 months and Dr. Sarno said resume physical activity. I could go on and on about how I've limited myself with "stories" of injury for so long and held back and never got better, only worse, so increase in activity is the way for me.

 

That’s great! It’s good to find who speaks to you.

Absolutely! And a big challenge!

Oh my! Well you have a lot to overcome, since you believe in the medical world, unlike some of us jaded rebels. Ultimately, you’ll understand more than any of us when you’re all through! This explains your perspective, also. I’m glad I know this now. Sorry to be hard on you!

 

If you have medical degrees then you know grinding and crunching audibly in your body is not a “ thing” other than your mind selectively choosing to turn up the volume on things that freak you out. I was a teenager when I had this. The physical therapist told me it was meaningless air bubbles and not to go back for more treatment (in ye olde days when they literally microwaved your knee! My knee was fine after that!

 

haha my medical degrees are Psychiatry! hahaha funny right?

But no, we were never told anything akin to our mind selectively turning up the volume on things to freak you out. I mean this is why TMS is not mainstream. And this was like 20 years ago so definitely no mind body anything.

The closest we got was Conversion Disorder which is now relabeled FND which of course is TMS. But like it was seen as this rare crazy old school Freudian thing which would be so out of the box because it would be like a patient was blind or suddenly paralyzed. Somatoform Disorder is seen as "Hysterical" to use old school Freud and well Malingering and Factious Disorder are seen as for secondary gain.

And you know what we were told my first year that I never forgot? "Rule out anything medical before assuming Psychiatric!" I still live that to this day. Which however it not against Sarno as he said anything deadly, infectious, etc. should be ruled out of course and Sarno does not say throw away the entire medical industry.

Never heard about microwaving a knee! Crazy!

 

right. big questions for my whole life huh?

 

Hey DR - I have read this whole thread and have a lot of questions and comments, but I homed in on this when I read it because it lit up my "must comment!" brain.

So as a longtime runner, I am very familiar with the running community and many of my closest friends are in my particular running group.

HOWEVER...

Runners are Type A - a high-strung and often judgmental/critical group. You need look no further than the LetsRun dot come forum for evidence of what I speak. When you're in a running group, there can be a lot of pressure that comes out of that. To be with the "fast group" and not the "joggers" - and within the "fast group" to beat some of your group members at races (or just training runs!). This is pressure we're putting on ourself - but sadly there is also that judgment that comes from others too, external pressure - some of it good natured, but not all of it. When you get into an injury situation - or something like you've been experiencing - there can be a lot of well-meaning concern or chatter about "what's wrong with DR?" and so forth. (The truth is of course - we think people care aLOT more than they actually do, most people are too focused on themselves to give any of us much thought - but the point is we THINK they do - again applying pressure.)

Anyway, my point in all this I get that aspect of wanting to join that group and be in that community - but unfortunately it's not the best kind of group for someone treating their TMS. It throws up too many obstacles, when we have enough of them already to deal with. I am not saying to remove yourself from that community, but instead maybe find some other groups that share interests of yours and in this case you can be selective to ensure it IS the kind of group that doesn't throw obstacles into your recovery path. Personally for this, I like to avoid competition groups altogether - my favorites are church groups, or simply spending time with your family (the good ones, not the ones that stress you out). I'm sure you can think of examples that suit you too. Good luck.

 

Totally agree! It's not healthy. I am actually not involved anymore. In fact I never was before we moved here and I knew no one. I quit all of my running groups and even have ended some friendships. However, there are still TONS of "running friends" on my Facebook which a lot of them are just local Detroit running people who I've legit never even met in person and don't want to see what they post nor for them to comment on me. So I do always consider the massive purge - but good old TMS people pleaser me is like that's mean they didn't do anything wrong. What will they think if you defriend them?

I have gotten messages every so often "how are you doing" which makes me feel awful like I'm this bizarre medical mystery (and maybe for them after they saw what happened, they have a fear in the back of their mind they could meet the same fate so to speak so want to know did I recover) so now I just don't answer anymore as it's none of their business.

I know I have taken way too much of the running communities comments or attitudes to heart over the years, way before I had TMS (or at least TMS in this current manifestation). All the stuff about injuries and what you should or should do to treat those or for training or cross training or rest days or whatever. Some of the comments people have made, which I am sure were made in a caring fashion, stick with me too long. I still have a great amount of rage about a lot of them that could fill many journals.

I don't post much about my running anymore, but I did post recently about running when I was down at Disney which for a variety of reasons is very important to me, and I got a comment that enjoy that run today as you never know what tomorrow will bring (this is from a person who clearly also has TMS). I did not hold back on saying I do not appreciate comments like that and that is not a helpful way of thinking.

I know, a waste of mental energy. Stupid social media. I fall into the trap. I was proud though I expressed my anger and held my boundaries though.

Thank you MHG as always.

 

Oh friend. I am like a glow stick without the fun colors. Pre-lifting stretching and you would think I just busted out a pack of Pop Rocks. I have osteoarthritis in my knees and hips so I hear you on honing in on the joints we use the most with running.

I'm still in a couple of running groups but mainly one where we are deliberately off the wall so there's not a lot of talk about injuries or anything like that. I do still post in another less humorous running group but just mainly post and run, and like other running posts. I slide on by anything about injuries.

 

Not just a waste, it actually brings negative energy. And that's just regular social media. Then you get something like Strava which is running-specific social media and it can be really damaging.

Oh, on the pops/noises? It's nothing. I am sure one of the Sarno books covers this - "so your body makes noises? so what? who cares."