Severe Symptoms & Steve O's Book

I've have read a number of books on TMS/MBS over the past several weeks. One message I see throughout some of the books is that if one has severe and debilitating symptoms e.g. fibromyalgia then resolving TMS issues on your own is not going to work. It is recommended that the patient seeks psychological therapy for any trauma, PTSD, inner rage etc. Is this forum for people with more milder/moderate symptoms? More recently I have become aware of how many symptoms I've experienced over the years that were probably TMS but, at the time, I had no idea as they were more mild/moderate. However, the recent severity of symptoms has really impacted my life; sitting hurts my hips/legs, inhaling causes strain in my abdominal muscles. I'm in the middle of reading the book 'The Great Pain Deception" and it looks like the author (Steve O) had some really severe symptoms which he resolved on his own but I'm finding it a really hard read. There are some contradictions and elements that are too unbelievable. For example, he would say that he could not lie, sit or walk for months and had to live on all fours then on a subsequent paragraph he would say that he was bed bound for months (which is it?). He would then go on to say that he resolved his pains on sitting in 30 minutes or so by sitting on a chair with his wife distracting him from the pains. If true that to me tells me his pains were more from conscious fear of sitting than anything to do with inner rage. Also, as Sarno says, if you get a quick resolution to pains it's probably a placebo effect (I agree with Sarno). I truly believe that people can resolve psychologically generated pains with TMS therapy but there are too many elements of that book that makes no sense to me. This isn't meant to be a thread to bash Steve's book but rather to wanted to understand whether my perception of the book is shared by others or, perhaps, I misunderstood what he was saying. Steve makes lots of references about TMS being caused by a lack of blood flow O2 but, as I now understand it, that this theory has been refuted. I have the 2018 edition of this book and I wonder why there re still references to this theory. I think Steve has went through hell with his wife's disability, the court case, the deaths of his family members etc and I empathise with the guy. I also have a lot of respect for him for pulling through his pains and becoming pain free. However, the book is one man's story and isn't scientific at all. I much prefer Sarno's and Alan's books. Oh yeah, on page 198 he goes on to say don't just re-read his book instead buy another copy and re-read the new copy! I do not personally recommend that book at all. Is there a hidden intension to increase book sales? I really didn't like the way he came across in his book. For those of you that read Steve's book what were your take away thoughts?

 

Hi Mike,
Different healing stories speak to different people. Personally, I get a lot out of Steve O’s determination. That’s what inspires me about his story. But it’s not essential to like his book. Just dig around and find people who inspire you and follow them. You have to create your own unique path.

As far as therapy goes. Sarno recommended it for people with adverse childhoods. I’ve done a lot of it, and it didn’t cure me. But I think it helped me understand some things that will ultimately contribute to my recovery from TMS.

Mind if I’m honest with you? You always seem to come on here with some kind of urge for controversy. You know that’s your TMS brain trying to distract you, right?

 

I didn't like it. But...I like some of his comments and contributions here on this forum. He's insightful.

 

His book is another derivative of Sarno's books, and I find it complicated. I would go back to read the original " Healing Back Pain" as one would study the Bible. It doesn't matter as much regarding the oxygen hypothesis. The key is the difficult emotions one can't face. All kinds of chronical or even short lived symptoms could be generated by mindbody when one cant face or feel difficult emotions (it is an integrated whole system in my opinion and could not be seperated), which happens all the time with modern life stressors and individual upbringing and interactions with others.

 

Well, that's the thing, Diana, I do not know what I'm being distracted from. Over a decade ago I did a lot of internal work on myself in relation to the abuse (neglect) I had in childhood. I read a lot of books on the subconscious mind which I applied to my life. That helped me grow emotionally and I felt more confident and free. I said to myself those were the cards I was dealt with in life. I had little control over those cards and I felt exonerated. I felt no blame directed to the child within me and understood full well that my perpetrators were the one's responsible for the crimes of neglect against me. The more I introspectively looked at things the more I realised that my perpetrators were the ones with the problem i.e. they had significant mental issues. I began to live my life the way I chose to live it, to have compassion on myself and set firmer boundaries on what I want/didn't want. It wasn't perfect but life, although far from perfect, was good over the past decade. I removed myself from the perpetrators ans I learned to adopt mindfulness to my life and I generally felt at peace. Last year, I wanted to step things up and felt confident enough to do what I always wanted to do i.e. move abroad and start a new life. I remember telling my sibling that I now feel ready to put the past to bed and do not wish to talk about it anymore. I want to move forward with my life as I understood/accepted my past and there's nothing else to talk about. I did and I felt at peace saying that. I felt much love for myself and felt exonerated from the past. So, I do wonder what my TMS brain is trying to distract me from? I wonder what it wan't from me. Perhaps my subconscious does not want me to move on and created significant pain and discomfort as a way to slam the brakes on me living my life. I'm honestly not looking for any kind of controversy or any kind of confrontation. I think what I'm feeling is frustration. I do not know what my TMS brain wants or is asking for. I recently bought a pair of boxing gloves and started imagining my perpetrators in the punching bag and that has helped release some inner rage. I never cried in so many years or got angry at things. Perhaps I intellectualised things so much but never felt the associated emotions (anger, rage, sadness) and that is at the core of it. Anyways I apologise to anyone if they have taken offense to my posts; that is never my intention.

 

Yes, I agree, that is an amazing book!

 

Bingo! (imo) Your job is not to resist the symptoms ("What you resist, not only persists, but will grow in size" - Carl Jung). Remember that your amygdala/limbic system/'lizard brain' has only two settings 'danger' and 'all clear'. Throughout the day regularly check in with yourself and ask yourself how/what you are feeling... and say to yourself "I am feeling angry" (or whatever) and if you can't work out what you're feeling, say to yourself "I don't know exactly what it is, but I recognise that I am feeling something" and then proceed to get on with your day as best you can despite whatever symptoms you are experiencing. This will show your 'lizard brain' that its alarms (the symptoms it creates to attract your attention and to try and hobble you) have been noted and not ignored and that what you're doing and experiencing is not a danger to your existence and it can go to its 'all clear' setting. In time it will learn not to overreact. This usually takes time and patience.

Steve O's book was too much for me personally, but for others his story has been the inspiration for their recovery... as @Diana-M says, it's about finding who/what inspires you personally. I got to the point in his book where he was forcing himself to run a long way, play golf and was in so much pain afterwards that he had to recover by lying on the bonnet/hood of his car (if my memory serves me correctly, or suchlike if it doesn't!) and I thought "this isn't for me". I might not be fully recovered like Steve O, but I am a hell of a lot better than I was by challenging my 'lizard brain' with doing lesser more general everyday activities, purely taking 'baby steps' - or 'building up steps' as I now prefer to call them - towards my full recovery.

 

BloodMoon ... Your messages are always appreciated. Have you ever been in a position when your brain questions your TMS diagnosis. For example, Sarno speaks about TMS in simple terms i.e. IF not structural THEN TMS. But ... what if the pain is not structural but is, for example, autoimmune? I recently been reading about Chronic Inflammatory Demyelenating Polyneuropathy (CIDP) where the immune system attacks the nerves. Would CIPD be considered TMS? My brain is now asking me to be tested for CIDP and nerve conduction testing. I do wonder what Sarno et. al. would say about this i.e. when does testing end? Perhaps autoimmune is ultimately TMS ... I don't know. I will carry on my TMS journey but the "what ifs" are driving me insane. Did you ever get tested for nerve autoimmune diseases like CIDP?

 

this is how the TMS brain perpetuates your situation, just one more test, one more Dr etc. we can plug our symptoms into google and get a dozen different possible diagnoses. If you want to go for these tests and see these doctors, fine, but just know a negative result isn’t necessarily going to put your concerns to bed. You ease your worries by doing the work, gaining evidence that what you’re doing is working and the rest takes care of itself. If at every turn you’re going ‘well it might be this or that instead of TMs’ then that is giving into fear. You don’t have to believe 100% and your brain isn’t necessarily trying to distract you from something. Your symptoms themselves could be the scare event that shocked your body into prolong fight or flight which keeps the nervous system heightened, which in turn could stem from past traumas. Have you looked into Dan Buglio’s approach?

 

[QUOTE Your symptoms themselves could be the scare event that shocked your body into prolong fight or flight which keeps the nervous system heightened, which in turn could stem from past traumas. Have you looked into Dan Buglio’s approach?[/QUOTE]

Bingo! I think there’s a lot of truth into that! I’ve never heard of Dan Buglio. Are you able to provide me with a link to his approach? Thanks for responding.

 

Bingo! I think there’s a lot of truth into that! I’ve never heard of Dan Buglio. Are you able to provide me with a link to his approach? Thanks for responding.[/QUOTE]
He has a whole YouTube channel, pain free you, very accessible. His main approach is perceived danger pain, still TMS, but less focused on underlying emotions being the root cause, emotions can be the cause but the fear of the pain and symptoms themselves could be driving prolonged fight or flight.

 

Not wishing to seem or to be glib, but the answer to this is: when you decide it should end. (Sadly, some TMSers never decide that point has come for them, so they never knuckle down and do mind/body work and never lose their symptoms and get better.)

No one here can say at what point you should stop looking for other explanations for symptoms because we're not medical professionals.

No, I never got tested for CIDP.

Research does suggest that chronic psychological stress can influence immune function and may exacerbate or increase susceptibility to inflammatory and autoimmune diseases, including those involving demyelination...

However, CIDP is a rare condition so chances are that you don't have it, but my guess is that your 'what if-ing' brain will likely just say to that "although rare, you still might have it!" or "what about MS?... that's more common than CIDP, you might have that instead!"

As @Rabscuttle says...

... your 'lizard brain' will more than probably go on to scaring you and pointing you in the direction of some other disease that you 'might just have'.

As @Rabscuttle also says, you don't have to believe 100%... and so, as I've said before, you can simply decide to 'suspend your disbelief' and get on with mind/body work (while you may or may not be seeking medical opinion as to whether you might have CIPD).

 

There comes a point where you've done enough digging and there's several people that would agree with me. I did a lot of digging in my past, several times, and became frustrated because I wasn't making progress with a specific symptom. Then I shifted gears and accepted that I've done enough digging and am moving forward now. We cannot keep living in the past. We have to stop creating so much internal pressure. Yes, there is work required at the beginning of the journey and I encourage it (as others do too). My symptoms calmed down over time, it's not an overnight fix. These false alarms have been blaring for so long; you have to actively teach your brain, move on with life, move on with activities. Hope this helps.

 

Hi, Mike,
I really feel for your story. I have deep compassion for your pain and for your frustration that your TMS will not go away. It sounds like we probably had similar childhoods, as far as abuse goes. I like to put it this way: you name the abuse, it happened to me. My parents were young and really messed up and they messed me up.

I’ve had 10 years of therapy. Most recently on my quest to get rid of TMS I had three years of internal family systems therapy, which I can honestly say nearly destroyed me. The pain was unreal. The reason I bring all this up is that @JanAtheCPA said something one time that really hit me. She said for people who’ve been through a lot of abuse, the protection mechanism that your lizard brain has is just so strong that it takes quite an effort to get it to let go. This perspective is what keeps me going— I think one of these days —I don’t know when— I’ll break out of this.

When I compare myself to other people and how fast they may or may not heal their TMS it only makes me really sad and frustrated. I can’t change the cards I’ve been dealt and neither can you. Many people like us stay sick our whole lives or die or kill ourselves or overdose. But here we are on a TMS website talking to each other trying to get better.

I also look at my recovery like trying to pick a master lock. I want this dang lock opened! I’m not going to stop until I get this thing opened. I might have to try all sorts of approaches. (You might really like Dan Buglio; he had TMS for 12 years and got rid of it. He has a website and a new book. He also has counseling in groups by Zoom. I’ll put the links at the end of this.)

The reason I highlighted your quote above is that it shows to me that you still have some pain in there that you never were able to express. You finally cried, after you were punching your parents on the bag. This is great! Maybe you should keep those boxing gloves on for a while and keep punching away.

I truly hope and pray for your recovery. I can imagine how incredibly disappointed you are that this TMS has come back again to haunt you, just when you were trying to build a new life. I could see why some people do want to give up hope. I fight that every day. But as I always say to myself, what other choice do I have but to keep doing the work to heal my TMS?

Personally, in my opinion, I think if you go back to the medical world, you’re just going to be on a merry go round. They will torture you some more and then you’ll eventually have to come back to your TMS approach. Why not just cut out the middleman and keep doing the TMS work?

Sending love and prayers your way. I hope you feel better!

Dan Buglio:
https://www.painfreeyou.com/ (Pain Free You - Chronic Pain Self Assessment)

 

@mikeinlondon Hey Mike- I added Dan Buglio also I edited my post to clear up anything that was confusing so maybe if there was anything confusing you might want to look at it again lol

 

Thanks for your input, Diana. Do you mind if I ask how your symptoms got triggered? Was it phased or did you wake up one morning in immense pain? An interesting note to point out is that I have a device that measures HRV and breaks down time during the day between sympathetic and parasympathetic activity. Now, correlation is not necessarily causation, but I've noticed that since I've been doing TMS work my nervous system is slowly transitioning to more and more parasympathetic activity. I will certainly keep on doing the TMS work. I think it wouldn't hurt working on the physical i.e. they don't need to be independent. I believe that whatever is causing my symptoms is ultimately controlled by the brain so that is where most of my focus should be. I've recently reached out to a spiritual healer for healing. Have you tried that? I'm a very scientific kinda guy but recently I have been questioning whether there are external forces on the other side influencing our psychic energies.

 

Mike,
My TMS has flared on and off since childhood. Most of the time it went away over time by ignoring it, placebos and once, using meditation. I discovered Sarno in 2017 and had a book cure. Stress was mounting for me starting around 2018 for a number of reasons, and exploded into symptoms in 2020. The pandemic definitely helped trigger it. Fear and anxiety! I got knee pain, then numbness. In 2023, I got COVID for the first time (I was terrified to get it), and more symptoms were added after that. My hands curled. About a year ago, I had 16 symptoms. Now I’m down to 8. Walking is my biggest issue right now. I can’t, without assistance. And, my hands aren’t fully functional. So I’d love these to improve! My pain is mostly from tensed muscles and tendons—and not as bad as some people have. But I also have balance issues and anxiety, numbness and tingling. I count myself lucky not to be doubled up in pain. I can sit without pain. Another blessing.

That’s cool you are able to measure your parasympathetic nerves. I cured severe anxiety once just by meditating an hour a day for a year. I know a sensitized nervous system plays a huge part in TMS. And you can see that, from your scientific perspective. Nice!

Spiritual healing. I note that it seems to be a key component for those on this forum who have healed. Many are into Eastern religions. And even people without any beliefs get a lot from meditation—and it becomes somewhat of a spiritual experience for them. I learn many things from their discussions of this.

As for me, I’m a devout Catholic. (Converted from basic Christianity about 10 years ago.) With my TMS challenges, my faith has deepened, as have all my daily practices that bring me peace. It also provides me with a profound sense of purpose and meaning, as well as an understanding of the beneficial role suffering plays in human existence. My faith is also a huge buffer against the fears this world presents and the uncertainties that can be easily destabilizing. So, right now, I’ve got a pretty big engine roaring in the spiritual department, personally. I count myself blessed to have this because I spent most of my life searching for it.

I think spirituality is a big benefit to anyone, especially us TMSers. So I’d say, go for it.

 

@mikeinlondon
“I've recently reached out to a spiritual healer for healing. Have you tried that? I'm a very scientific kinda guy but recently I have been questioning whether there are external forces on the other side influencing our psychic energies.”

Dr. Hanscom has had some involvement with clients who have had success by doing TMS work and exploring spiritual healing to help them feel more safe and accepted. The film Love Heals is about one of his clients who eventually discovered blocked childhood abuse (which is what my therapist suspects happened to me in infancy, or before I could speak). She is also so producing a new film about horses, and emotional healing, safety and acceptance.
The biggest thing I will suggest is that you look upon these people as people. They hold no magic keys, and cannot heal you. The entire focus of TMS healing is for you to gain the trust in yourself and your own power to heal -which is pretty spiritual in its own way. It’s also good to have genuine people who believe in you and will keep you on course with your own path. One of the keys to my own healing is to find folks who might not believe in, say Sarno’s theories but who are willing to honor my own choices and beliefs (even if they challenge them, respectfully). Along the way my exercise coach has become a TMS coach, my physical therapists office is now recommending Sarno and Gordon books and is referring people to TMS and mind/body practitioner's. Complex TMS folks may take longer to heal but that experience seems to stick with them. When more suspected TMS pops up they seem to have a greater understanding of what it is and how to nip it in the bud quickly. I used spiritual philosophies to work with mindset, personality traits and fear but kept very clear that I wasn’t relying on someone else to magically heal me so I did not have to do the work. That’s what I took from Steve 0’s book (most of it didn’t resonate with me until I was farther along in my healing).