'Quit Ruminating & Brooding' - a book by psychologist Olle Wadstrom

In another thread I was saying that I'm "too lazy to be OCD", but it has recently occurred to me that, although I don't have physical rituals, my thoughts still loop a lot.

For instance, I have been, and still am, experiencing an extremely trying few weeks of needing to deal with people that I don't want to have to deal with about things that I don't want to be having to deal with (and having to make decisions about) and my brain doesn't switch off easily. I'll have a 'difficult' conversation with someone and my thoughts revisit it, and sometimes this 'revisiting', albeit usually intermittent, doesn't let go for around 2 to 3 days (or whatever) afterwards...

That made me realise that I need to tackle this because I believe it more than probably has a lot of bearing with regard to my residual mind/body symptoms that are still gradually lessening a bit with me continuing to do mind/body work (in my case this involves taking 'baby steps' with my activities) but haven't left me as yet (albeit I am generally 'outcome independent' regarding this in my day to day life).

So, anyway, I decided to look into doing something about my 'ruminating' and was recommended this book: 'Quit Ruminating and Brooding: how ruminating and worry work and what to do to overcome them' by a Swedish psychologist called Olle Wadstrom. Here's a review of the book by someone: https://www.forewordreviews.com/reviews/quit-ruminating-and-brooding/

As the reviewer says: "The book advocates for accepting one’s worries as plausible and suggests that blowing worries up into a worst-case scenario helps to slow ruminating behavior, easing fear through exposure."

What the author also says (which I'm paraphrasing) is that when we comfort ourselves with 'comforting thoughts' (which is usually an automatic habit of interrupting that we have gotten into) it kind of seemingly 'works' for just a little while but then the desire/need for comfort only spirals up and up and up (with each time we do this). So what he advises to do is to not engage with 'comforting thoughts' or to listen to words of comfort from those around us (they are often not true or hollow anyway) and to allow our 'discomforting thoughts' without engaging in the interrupting 'comforting thoughts' - which he says will in response reduce the looping and will be liable to stop the looping (the latter with persistently doing this to make it a new habit).

For anyone familiar with his work, this seems to me to tie in with what Helmut (aka 'The Mindful Gardener') on YouTube says we need to do... he says words to the effect of 'when you're suffering anxiety and looping thoughts... welcome them in... roll in them, bathe in them' and they will lose their grip and reduce and eventually go (because “what you resist not only persists, but will grow in size” ~ Carl Jung)

I can see now that 'comforting thoughts' have been stopping me from fully allowing my 'discomforting thoughts' and feeling my emotions, and that's because I have not wanted to experience the discomfort (but, of course, we need to experience those emotions to release them and essentially 'take the charge out of them') -- a big 'light bulb moment' realisation for me! (The 'comforting thoughts' act as a 'dam'.)

Anyway, I'm still reading the book but, having got the gist of it, I am applying what I've learned from it so far to my current ongoing 'lifey hassles' situation and my goodness doing this is already starting to help me - a lot (for one thing I'm sleeping really well, despite the hassles!)... So, I thought I'd share...

That said though, a reviewer on Amazon wrote the following: "as a self-help strategy for people with already troubled minds, I fear this this method might be too dangerous to try at home alone", so I am adding this as a caution.

However, my own personal reaction to this approach is, so far anyway, looking more like this other review of the book on Amazon:

"I got this book after feeling like I was losing my mind with constant ruminations. I had never heard of ruminations until a year ago but realised unknowingly I was doing this a lot and it was causing me sleepless nights which was really dragging me down. I am definitely in the OCD part whether it comes to decisions, apprehension - without even knowing it, this book has helped me see what I have been doing and relate. Since I have started applying the techniques in the book, I have slept solid for the last 5 nights and my mind feels so much calmer. I am finally feeling like I am in a better place and if I look back over the years, there are definitely behaviours that I now know I want to change and it is within my power to change so the future looks good. A big thank you to the author."

 

Thanks for this, @BloodMoon. I relate to your situation. It’s so easy to ruminate when times get tough. I do the exact same thing. And yes, looping thoughts are OCD. The Mindful Gardener even warns that OCD looping thoughts often get worse through the healing process. They sure have for me. I release some of them by letting them run rampant (can’t stop them anyway!)

 

@BloodMoon
The #1 thing I like most about your post is your willingness to look at yourself again and challenge your belief eg. That OCD is only a physical manifestation - which, like TMS it is always rooted in the psychological and that you aren’t judging it’s’ presence. This is a such a wonderful example of a mindset of healing.
It sounds like you are right about the similarity to Helmut’s technique for dealing with OCD. I too can ruminate and OCD things and decided a while ago to simply notice it, notice behavior/thought around it and just let it be. Once I recognized how it can create stress, I realized I had an opportunity to pick and choose my battles. Sometimes it’s ok to have comforting thoughts or non-detrimental distractions, occasionally I do need to kind of ruminate (and not put things on the back burner all the time because someone else can/won’t deal with it). I just try and keep an open mind about what I’m really doing.

 

Thank you for that, @Cactusflower!

This is exactly it! - Seeing what we are really doing... Until now I was totally unaware of just how much and how frequently my brain produces automatic 'comforting thoughts' due to my resistance to mental discomfort. If you'd have asked me a few days ago, I'd have said that my brain didn't produce hardly any 'comforting thoughts', if at all!

 

You're welcome! I think you must have been a leap ahead of me in letting them 'run rampant'; I just didn't realise that I was automatically plugging them from that with 'comforting thoughts'. Tbh I'm flabbergasted at this revelation... my 'flabber' has never been so 'gasted'!

 

That’s really great you came to this realization! That’s a huge insight! I bet you’ll make some good progress with this.

As I read your post, I realized how little I provide comforting thoughts to myself. So that’s my realization! Probably there should be some balance. A few comforting thoughts wouldn’t hurt.

 

I'm pleased that this prompted this realization! Maybe the comforting thoughts needed are about feeling good about yourself, seeing and realising what a lovely person you are, not underplaying your achievements and your determination and resolve etc...

Whereas I believe the 'comforting thoughts' that Wadstrom is talking about are such stuff as when we making excuses for others' behaviour, telling ourselves that something will change when in reality we know that it won't, trying to rationalising things, kidding ourselves that we accept or like something when we don't, and so on. I guess a lot of the 'comforting thoughts' he's talking about are to do with pretending to ourselves... I'll have to examine that more as I carry on reading the book, but so far I have gathered that the 'comforting thoughts' or mental responses are those that attempt to soften, explain away, or provide solutions to the discomforting or worrying thoughts.

 

Oh my! This is incredibly timely. This is happening to me right now. I am facing a new layer of my psychological onion skin that involves just this. Admitting what really is. Admitting that most of my family growing up, and now my siblings, my children and daughters-in-law are mainly cruel to me, with the exception of a few of them.

It takes a lot of bravery to admit this truth to oneself. Because instantly, there’s phenomenal pain, and loneliness on an existential level. The world spins into darkness and you actually want to take it out on yourself. At least I do. If people hate me and exclude me, it MUST be something I’ve done. But actually, no. They are sick individuals, and/or weak.

I’m dealing with 3 narcissists now (my sister, my son and one daughter-in-law). The rest are “flying monkeys,” to one degree or another. (I just learned what flying monkeys are. They are like the monkeys in the Wizard of Oz who assist the wicked witch. In this case, they assist the narcissists in bringing about their plans of your demise. The monkeys don’t always know that’s what they are doing. But the effects are still the same. They hit their target.)

Needless to say, this reality has gone from being a concept in my life, to a full blown reality that I can feel and accept. It almost seems crazy. Can this all really be true? Yes. Unfortunately, it can. The pain is flooding over me. And my body is doing things it’s never done yet to shut me down. Big attempts to get me in bed. But I’m fighting. And I’m winning. But it’s scary sometimes.

I finally got the nerve to pull the trigger on going no contact with my sister. (I hated to have to do this.) Lots more is going on. I’m journaling page after page each day. And LOTS and LOTS of meditation and EFT tapping. And prayer.

I believe this narcissism in my family is my core issue. It’s the root of all the pain I feel. And I’ve reached rock bottom. Finally. But I’m not out of the woods yet. My subconscious brain has all the fire alarms on full blast. It’s not liking it one bit.

So, I guess long story short, I support the work you’re doing. It’s extremely hard. Extremely. (And I consider myself a tough cookie.) The only way to survive an onslaught of hatred from people who you had hoped would love you—is to love yourself more and more each day. Because that love will build the boundaries needed and the protection you deserve. And there can still be peace despite not having the support you always wanted. It’s ok. It can be done. You can have a life. And I’m going to prove it. I deserve to stop drinking poison every day and wondering why I’m so sick. My TMS is just a reflection of the terror I’ve shouldered. But those days are gone. No more poison. Only peace. My body doesn’t have to do the screaming anymore for me.

I truly wish the same for you, too, @BloodMoon. Peace.

 

You absolutely needed to do this; you need to release yourself from all the toxicity. Now that you're letting go, I can't imagine that your hands won't unfurl with the rest of your body following suit in due course, because you are making this momentous decision to create a new life of peace for yourself. I suggest from hereon to do what Teal Swan says and that's to ask yourself 'What would someone who loves themselves do?' before every decision and act on the immediate, intuitive answer to support your well-being. Embracing self-love means giving yourself permission to rest and to nurture your soul with kindness and compassion every single day. ❤️

 

Thank you, Dear @BloodMoon ❤️ I learned about narcissism and the damage it inflicts here on the forum, with you leading the way. I knew nothing about it.

 

For most of my life I didn't know anything about it either. I wished I'd known earlier, especially when I was working, it would have explained a lot with regard to the awful behaviour of certain colleagues.

 

You might already have this kind of information, but I've looked out an article that I'd saved a while back about the different 'flying monkey' types there are (to include that they often have their own 'disorder' going on) https://psychcentral.com/pro/exhausted-woman/2019/07/narcissists-and-their-flying-monkeys#4 (Narcissists and Their Flying Monkeys) From my own experience of dealing with narcissists it helps to understand their 'enablers'.

Something that the article doesn't go into (which again, you might already know about) is that in general people more than seem to have a deep rooted aversion to believing that anyone is a narcissist or sociopath. I found this quite shocking. They will usually agree that they do exist if you ask them, but they won't believe that anyone they know, or ever come in contact with, could possibly be one. They will try and explain away, and even say or imply, that the narcissist's bad behaviour towards you is due to something that you have done or not done that's provoked that behaviour or that the bad behaviour didn't happen or you're mistaken about it being bad behaviour or that it was unintentional or you took things 'the wrong way' -- even when they have not been recruited by the narcissist as a flying monkey! Or they will propose that someone else (that neither you or they know) must have done whatever it is, e.g. it must have been the mailman or the leaflet distributor or some local kids who when it was dark surreptitiously dumped a load of garbage in your yard or put dog's mess on your doorstep or spread rumours about you (or whatever). It's like most people are born with an in-built 'blind spot' to narcissism (and they actually think that narcissists and sociopaths/psychopaths only 'exist' in the movies). This in-built 'blind spot' means that it's so easy peasy for narcissists to recruit flying monkeys (like you say, many flying monkeys don't know they are being used and manipulated).

I am so sorry you're having to go through this. Obviously, post up when you are in need of some moral support as you are carving out a new peaceful life for yourself.

 

Thank you for your help, @BloodMoon! It’s a lonely place to be, for sure— Nobody to believe you. It’s even hard to accept the information about narcissists when they are right there in your life.

If I weren’t as debilitated with TMS as I am, with as much pain as I’ve been in, I never ever would’ve looked at all of this. I just kept going back and looking at the people I was around when the symptoms got worse, and it was a perfect storm of three of them. Every time I saw them, I got sicker. I’ll spare the details here, but there’s all sorts of triangulation going on. It’s not even worth using this space to describe it, but it’s honestly nothing short of demonic. (And yes, I write this now thinking many people will read this and think I’m absolutely crazy.) All I know is that it took my health down. And when I read about what narcissism can do—I know it absolutely can destroy people. Reddit threads on narcissism have been really helpful to me. And I discovered through those threads that it’s also a generational and family problem. My story is typical for people who have narcissism in their family. Sadly, true.

More recently, this fall, my sister reappeared in my life (without my invitation) and stirred up all sorts of things and my symptoms flared like never before. I think it was the last straw that finally made me realize I have to draw the line. I have to be strong enough to let her go completely and stop lying to myself.

Last night I was reading about trauma bonding. Because I know that there’s a very close tie between she and I. We went through childhood trauma together, so we are bonded that way. And then I also bonded to her through the trauma she delivers to me— The dopamine ride. Giving love and withdrawing it. What’s incredibly astounding is how long this has gone on— A lifetime! I guess I was able to sustain it for a while without TMS, or maybe it was always the cause of every TMS I’ve ever had. But whatever the reason… About five years ago, it really got me. It was more than I could sustain.

I can see now what a big road to healing I have ahead. I’m trying not to worry into the future about what kind of trouble she will cause now that I’ve cut her off. I just need to stay in my bubble of peace and allow my nervous system to heal. (She came to my city from out of town and rallied all my kids. I didn’t see her. My anger went through the roof. It’s so crazy-making. So now things are even different with each of my kids.) I’m trying to just lay low and avoid everybody for a while to calm down my system.

I know a lot of people have different faith beliefs here on the forum so I respect that. But I must say that without God, I would never be able to overcome this. I feel like I’ve been building my faith more recently and that’s what’s giving me the strength to finally be willing to see what’s really happening. This faith gives me hope that I’ll be able to make it out of this. I’m also blessed that my husband completely believes everything and can see it. So I have his full support, which I thoroughly appreciate. And yours! Thank you so much! It really means a lot.

 

I'm so pleased to hear that you have got your husband's support and therefore a firm base from which to take one day at a time to continue to heal.

I say 'continue to heal' because the work you have been doing over the last year or so I think has actually been part of a healing process; understanding and recognising what has been going on is a major thing towards recovery.

I hadn't heard of trauma bonding before but it makes perfect sense as to why it has been especially difficult for you to cut ties with your sister.

I'm not minimising the process you will need go through, but I proffer that actually quite a lot of the road has already been covered with the work you have done leading up to this point. Getting some peace is the destination and you can and will get there.

 

Oh, I hope this is true! But I will say yes, it has taken a lot of time and effort to get to the point where my eyes were opened—and then more to get strong enough to do something about it. It’s exciting to think that I am getting out ahead of the lizard now! There can’t be much more to “protect” me from—I hope!

 

It's been wonderful to follow your healing journey, Diana. The fact that you write so well and generously on this Forum, is certain to help many people facing the same issues.

I'm going to add one insight from my own healing journey. There is a tone of victimhood in your posts, which is understandable given all you've endured. And it seems necessary to employ avoidance while you regroup. But based on my own healing journey, I think you will ultimately need to strengthen your boundaries and face the narcissists head on. TMS is an avoidance strategy by our unconscious mind, and to give it up we need to give up all avoidance eventually. This takes believing in our own strength and autonomy. This is a big hurdle, but I know you will overcome it in time.

 

Ellen,
I really appreciate your support and advice throughout my journey. And I’m grateful for your perspective about the victimhood. I’ll be mindful of that. It is amazing how my TMS has actually protected me from so much. I agree I’ll have to take it from here and stand on my own. (Literally!) Thank you!

 

Also, once our boundaries are strengthened we can reach into feelings of compassion towards the person who is lashing out at us. We can realize they are doing it out of their own deep pain, and see it's not about us, but them. There is a delicate balance between not blaming ourselves and feeling compassion for the person lashing out. It's difficult but it completely changes the dynamics of the relationship. Love, compassion and forgiveness are always the answer--for ourselves and the others involved.

 

“ It's difficult but it completely changes the dynamics of the relationship. Love, compassion and forgiveness are always the answer--for ourselves and the others involved.”

Which means you can have a better frame of mind to choose to engage someone or not. I cut off the two narcissists (and a few others) in my life having full compassion for their situation… and mine. I chose that my peace of mind meant cutting ties. That inevitably ended up cutting ties with the people they influenced - those people chose to believe the narcissists for whatever reason. Knowing none of this really has anything to do with yourself, that you are simply caught up in the fray can help you unravel all your own feelings of guilt, shame, past complacency, abandonment and betrayal. I am infinitely more at peace even if I have fewer people in my social circle.