I was wondering if others have experienced something like that. My main issues are and have (for a long time) been IBS, TMJ, teeth anxiety and footpain. Lately my footpain is completely gone but my IBS and teeth anxiety (probably connected with the flareup of the IBS) are worse than ever. It feels as if my brain decides what it is gonna be this time. Of course I know that my brain is influenced by my thoughts. Thanks.
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Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
One symptom disappears and the others get worse
- Thread starter Indiana
- Start date
It works the same for me. My main issue was TOS, neck and lumbar back pain. I got rid of TOS quite easily when discovered it is TMS but the pain moved so many times now that I am not sure if there is any part of my body that didn't hurt. It moved to my calves and disabled me for weeks, then I ignored it and decided to run with massive pain. It got better in a few days and moved to my achilles tendon. I had it a few years ago and struggled for 4 years to get better so it got me frightened. Again, ignored it, it is still there, but I don't care and all of a sudden my hip and knee hurt so that I have difficulty walking. I keep ignoring it but every now and then I can't help but surrender and fuel the pain with my thoughts. I see all of this as a very clear confirmation that it must be TMS.
Cactusflower
Beloved Grand Eagle
Have either of you read a book by Dr. Sarno?
“My brain is influenced by my thoughts” - and your body is there for you to experience emotions.
It is the combination of these factors: your thoughts -mainly about yourself, consciously and subconsciously (usually in opposition to one another) and the emotions this opposition creates and how we suppress and or repress these emotions that creates TMS. It begins a cycle of stress, obsession with symptoms, fear and all of these are signs of anxiety. The nervous system then gets stuck in fight/ flight because you are always on alert from what is stressing or causing anxiety that you aren’t recognizing -usually because you are focusing on the pain (or ignoring their true cause).
Dr. Sarno’s treatment plan is not about simply ignoring symptoms. It’s about recognizing they are a sign that your body is crying out for you to pay attention to what is happening in the brain.
Sarno’s #1 edict is to think psychologically
If you have read a book by Sarno, I suggest you re-read. It seems over time, our minds that desperately try to hide he true source of our discomfort (Sarno suggests it’s rage created by the oppositional thoughts, generally about ourselves) and we seem to conveniently forget parts of his writing, and from what TMS is really all about. It’s just a continued attempt to keep us safe from whatever the brain has interpreted as unsafe: emotions, thoughts, and inevitably sensations.
The symptom imperative is a term used when symptoms shift and move. It’s a sign that we still need to deal with the cycles that create TMS.
“My brain is influenced by my thoughts” - and your body is there for you to experience emotions.
It is the combination of these factors: your thoughts -mainly about yourself, consciously and subconsciously (usually in opposition to one another) and the emotions this opposition creates and how we suppress and or repress these emotions that creates TMS. It begins a cycle of stress, obsession with symptoms, fear and all of these are signs of anxiety. The nervous system then gets stuck in fight/ flight because you are always on alert from what is stressing or causing anxiety that you aren’t recognizing -usually because you are focusing on the pain (or ignoring their true cause).
Dr. Sarno’s treatment plan is not about simply ignoring symptoms. It’s about recognizing they are a sign that your body is crying out for you to pay attention to what is happening in the brain.
Sarno’s #1 edict is to think psychologically
If you have read a book by Sarno, I suggest you re-read. It seems over time, our minds that desperately try to hide he true source of our discomfort (Sarno suggests it’s rage created by the oppositional thoughts, generally about ourselves) and we seem to conveniently forget parts of his writing, and from what TMS is really all about. It’s just a continued attempt to keep us safe from whatever the brain has interpreted as unsafe: emotions, thoughts, and inevitably sensations.
The symptom imperative is a term used when symptoms shift and move. It’s a sign that we still need to deal with the cycles that create TMS.
JanAtheCPA
Beloved Grand Eagle
Also, if you never did the Structured Educational Program, it will give you the tools to deal with setbacks - because TMS is a normal brain mechanism that simply does not work well in today's modern world with its infinite number of stressors. So there will always be setbacks. The more you practice and get better at being mindful of your emotions, the faster you will deal with setbacks in the future. This is good news.
It might help to remember that the TMS brain mechanism evolved eons ago and has never adapted to the teensy bit of time that humans have been dealing with the modern world. The mechanism worked great in the primitive world when we only had a few very tangible dangers to worry about, and very short lives in which to worry about them! It's a fact that the mechanism works for shit in the modern world.
It might help to remember that the TMS brain mechanism evolved eons ago and has never adapted to the teensy bit of time that humans have been dealing with the modern world. The mechanism worked great in the primitive world when we only had a few very tangible dangers to worry about, and very short lives in which to worry about them! It's a fact that the mechanism works for shit in the modern world.
I did read a book by Sarno and that was enough to decrease the level of pain in my neck, arm and thoracic spine to minimum. I also did the Structured Educational Program but the symptoms are still there. I am trying to be mindful, not just ignore the symptoms, and I also go through a therapy which is a massive help, too. The problem I see now after all that is the inability to be outcome independent. I keep checking if it still hurts or if the level of pain is better or worse. Sometimes it is extremely difficult when I can't walk without limping.
Cactusflower
Beloved Grand Eagle
@Bartek
Then you absolutely know where you need to go.
Anxiety.
Mindset
The Pain PT does an excellent job coaching people through the pain fear loop! https://www.thepainpt.com/news/face-your-fears-to-move-forward/ (Face Your Fears To Move Forward - The Pain PT)
Doing things you love really helps take your mind off of hypervigilance. It starts as simply just seconds at a time.
Then you absolutely know where you need to go.
Anxiety.
Mindset
The Pain PT does an excellent job coaching people through the pain fear loop! https://www.thepainpt.com/news/face-your-fears-to-move-forward/ (Face Your Fears To Move Forward - The Pain PT)
Doing things you love really helps take your mind off of hypervigilance. It starts as simply just seconds at a time.
This is actually what I discussed with my therapist yesterday. I love sports, especially road cycling and running. Obviously, my pain always occurs in the body part that are important to do these sports and that makes it so much more difficult for me to just enjoy them but I will try.
JanAtheCPA
Beloved Grand Eagle
Where does self-compassion come into it for you, @Bartek? I sense that you're being pretty hard on yourself. Your TMS brains LOVES pressure and judgement - they are great distractors. My therapist has said that Pressure leads to Judgement which leads to Repression which leads to Symptoms.
She gave me a quick little tool to stop the obsessive cycle of pressure and negative thoughts. Awareness that you're obsessing (aka Ruminating) is the first step, so hooray for that, right? When you become aware of obsessive negative thoughts and fears, literally say STOP to yourself. Stop and breathe a couple of times. Then ask yourself (writing this down would be even better, you just need a scrap of paper) What do you WANT?
This forces your brain to step out of the squirrel cage of "ack, stop this, I don't want this, this sucks, I'm never going to get better, what if this keeps going should I go see a specialist what if they find something what if I can't ever run or cycle again what if what if what if aaaaaaaaaargh!"
Instead, you stop, breathe, and come up with a short positive or constructive answer to the question. This not only breaks the obsessive negative rumination, but allows your brain to visualize, even briefly, a different outcome. Visualization is a surprisingly powerful self-healing technique. "I want to go take a run without worrying about whether I'm damaging my (whatever body part). "I want to go biking and have faith that I'm perfectly safe even if I feel a symptom" "I want to go out and f***ing enjoy myself for once!"
This is a brief exercise, but your TMS brain will resist it and provide all kinds of excuses to avoid it. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about!
Mind you, if you want to take this thought and keep writing, by all means do so! Perhaps just writing down what you WANT will trigger strong emotions around why you're not getting what you want. So even though this starts out as a brief positive exercise, you can take it any direction you want if it leads to examining your deeper emotions. Do you remember the free-writing exercises from the SEP? The experts say that this kind of writing is not about "keeping a journal" because you should not keep it. Simply scribble stuff down as it comes out of your brain, without editing or fixing it, without regard for syntax or spelling or even legibility, and afterwards dispose of it. Dr Hanscom calls it expressive writing, Nicole Sachs has created the term JournalSpeak, and I just call it writing shit down. Nicole even has recommendations for using a computer instead of pen/paper (How to JournalSpeak — The Cure for Chronic Pain).
Good luck!
She gave me a quick little tool to stop the obsessive cycle of pressure and negative thoughts. Awareness that you're obsessing (aka Ruminating) is the first step, so hooray for that, right? When you become aware of obsessive negative thoughts and fears, literally say STOP to yourself. Stop and breathe a couple of times. Then ask yourself (writing this down would be even better, you just need a scrap of paper) What do you WANT?
This forces your brain to step out of the squirrel cage of "ack, stop this, I don't want this, this sucks, I'm never going to get better, what if this keeps going should I go see a specialist what if they find something what if I can't ever run or cycle again what if what if what if aaaaaaaaaargh!"
Instead, you stop, breathe, and come up with a short positive or constructive answer to the question. This not only breaks the obsessive negative rumination, but allows your brain to visualize, even briefly, a different outcome. Visualization is a surprisingly powerful self-healing technique. "I want to go take a run without worrying about whether I'm damaging my (whatever body part). "I want to go biking and have faith that I'm perfectly safe even if I feel a symptom" "I want to go out and f***ing enjoy myself for once!"
This is a brief exercise, but your TMS brain will resist it and provide all kinds of excuses to avoid it. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about!
Mind you, if you want to take this thought and keep writing, by all means do so! Perhaps just writing down what you WANT will trigger strong emotions around why you're not getting what you want. So even though this starts out as a brief positive exercise, you can take it any direction you want if it leads to examining your deeper emotions. Do you remember the free-writing exercises from the SEP? The experts say that this kind of writing is not about "keeping a journal" because you should not keep it. Simply scribble stuff down as it comes out of your brain, without editing or fixing it, without regard for syntax or spelling or even legibility, and afterwards dispose of it. Dr Hanscom calls it expressive writing, Nicole Sachs has created the term JournalSpeak, and I just call it writing shit down. Nicole even has recommendations for using a computer instead of pen/paper (How to JournalSpeak — The Cure for Chronic Pain).
Good luck!
@JanAtheCPA you are very right. I would say I am my own greatest enemy. I am being harsh to myself for everything. For some time I managed to avoid that and dialogue with myself but I think I came to the point where I was trying too hard. The result was that I felt I absolutely have to control myself and never allow any negative emotions to rear their ugly head again which then made me feel pressured. So instead of being able to laugh the anxiety and pain off, I felt additional pressure, I had another task to do. This, I believe, led to my recent pain in my right leg. The good thing is that I am fully aware of that and I am pretty sure I will get back on track. I actually tried to send this signal to my brain yesterday. I decided to go for a walk, even though I could barely go further than 300m. I was about to quit but said to myself to walk for at least 15 mins. A mile later, my knee pain was replaced with massive lumbar spine pain. Now the leg hurts again but I feel much more positive there can't be anything wrong as the pain makes no sense at all.
ARCUser831
Well known member
This is 100% me, I have a number of symptoms that almost never occur at the same time. One flare is pure urinary urgency / frequent urination, and when that subsides, the vulvodynia symptoms flare up. One or the other. When some of symptom pops up, my primary symptoms are always nowhere to be found. It's like the mind (my mind at least) only have the capacity or need to produce one bothersome symptom at a time.
To me, it makes sense when you think of the purpose of TMS. If you had one single constant symptom, I think it would be easier to do this work and recover. Bouncing between symptoms constantly puts you on guard as one fades off and returns with a vengeance, over and over and over.
ARCUser831
Well known member
In response to the outcome independency, I struggle with that too on my bad days... I don't know if it is quite the same thing, but I've found that if I get out and do what I want to in spite of the pain/discomfort, even if it bothered me or I found myself monitoring it here and there during the event, I'll find that I'm proud of myself for having gone out and done something I enjoy or simply lived my life in spite of the pain. I realized that feeling glad I wasn't letting it get in the way of those things countered the negative thoughts I had being bothered by the pain in some way.
It helps me to feel like the pain is not dictating what I do or do not do each day, to know I'm giving it less power.
It is true the mind seems only have the capacity to produce one bothersome symptom at the time. It is as if it is saying “what shall We bother her with today” oh she has not had IBS for while, lets take that”. I know it sounds ridiculous but that is how it feels.
I had a severe attack of IBS 10 days ago. Never had it that bad. The stress was not too bad but that does not seem to be an obstacle. When that was over I suddenly got strange blisters in my mouth which the dentist has never seen. I can hardly eat. That of course adds to my anxiety. My teeth are a great worry to me and i think about them a lot.
But today i try to forget about the pain and am in the garden all day.
I am doing the same thing. I am not letting pain stop me from doing what I want to live my life.
ARCUser831
Well known member
I hope you were able to enjoy your gardening and get your mind off of your fears and pain for a period of time yesterday.
Have you tried journaling? You sound similar to my way of thinking in that you spend a lot of time preoccupied not only with your pain but with the fear you feel over your symptoms and potential future or returning symptoms. As I get further along on this journey, I recognize that until I can manage and even resolve my unhealthy fear response, I will never recover as much as I hope. I would recommend listening to some Nicole Sachs because she focuses much more directly on the emotional work than some of the other "authorities" on TMS.
ARCUser831
Well known member
It is happening slowly for me, but I do find more and more that I'm getting my life back and feeling more like myself as the weeks and months go by. When I look back at how small my world had become when the symptoms first started, it is easy to recognize I've come a long way, even if I feel I have much more progress to make.
2 weeks ago I decided to take a little break from running just to see if my knee would get better. It did, at least until I went for a run after 10 day break. The pain was even worse than before. That was obvious to me that the pain is TMS so I kept running regardless of the pain level. It didn't get any better so I started looking for some reinforcement. I bought "The Way Out" and that was the best thing I could possibly do! I knew all the theories but somehow I needed the book to guide me. So today I went for a run again, my knee pain was exruciating from the first step. I wanted to give up but then thought of somatic tracking. So I observed the pain without any judgement and fear. One mile into the run and my knee pain was gone together with achilles pain. I can't believe how effective this technique is. I know the pain may return but I couldn't care less. All of it gave my so much energy, such a relief.
TG957
Beloved Grand Eagle
My partner, an ultramarathoner, told me that if you keep running, the pain eventually goes away, by the 3rd mile if you are lucky; otherwise, by the 33rd mile for sure. Jokes aside, he inspired me to start running, which I did, at age of 58, and observed for myself that pain eventually does go away. It is also consistent with what Steve Ozanich wrote in his book. A lot of times, pain goes away once we stop giving it attention.